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UK government MPs are using Signal’s automatic deletion feature

private-eye.co.uk

11–20 of 123 posts

Re: UK government MPs are using Signal’s automatic deletion feature

#11
post #7

I think they ought to legislate this into normality. The alternative is to make it mandatory to note all conversations with colleagues for the public record, however trivial, which is obviously absurd. An IM conversation is a personal conversation, treating it any other way will stifle the effective function of government.

The media used does does not affect the privacy/non-privacy of the discussion in any way.

But it does. There's no expectation on politicians to record and publish their face-to-face one-on-one conversations.

Re: UK government MPs are using Signal’s automatic deletion feature

#12
post #2

For those unfamiliar, Private Eve is an excellent magazine with a long history. It takes a humourous but serious investgative look at UK politics, business etc looking at eg corruption and double standards. With cartoons and iconic front page puns. And for the large part it avoided the pitfalls of moving online. Current issue: https://www.private-eye.co.uk/current-issue

Private Eye avoided the paywall problem by not putting itself online at all, it only publishes selected articles online to leave you hungry for the rest :)

Re: UK government MPs are using Signal’s automatic deletion feature

#14
post #2

For those unfamiliar, Private Eve is an excellent magazine with a long history. It takes a humourous but serious investgative look at UK politics, business etc looking at eg corruption and double standards. With cartoons and iconic front page puns. And for the large part it avoided the pitfalls of moving online. Current issue: https://www.private-eye.co.uk/current-issue

A print subscription is £34 a year, delivered (in the U.K.). It’s ridiculously good value.

Re: UK government MPs are using Signal’s automatic deletion feature

#15
post #9

It’s “funny” how the U.K. government endorse signal for covering their tracks but want backdoors put in because other people can’t be trusted. Furthermore, it should be illegal for governments to use self-destructing messages.

Government secrecy should be absolutely restricted by the general public - it is the beginning of all corruption of government. The UK headed down the wrong path towards totalitarian class-ist society when it decided the common people shouldn't know their own governments' secrets.

Re: UK government MPs are using Signal’s automatic deletion feature

#16
post #2

For those unfamiliar, Private Eve is an excellent magazine with a long history. It takes a humourous but serious investgative look at UK politics, business etc looking at eg corruption and double standards. With cartoons and iconic front page puns. And for the large part it avoided the pitfalls of moving online. Current issue: https://www.private-eye.co.uk/current-issue

So good in fact that the managing editor is usually the most sued person in the UK.

Ian Hislop is a national treasure and his evidence to the select committee on press intrusion was both erudite and hilarious.

Re: UK government MPs are using Signal’s automatic deletion feature

#17
I’m in two minds about this. I think it’s pretty sleazy to be using signal to evade record keeping requirements. I also think it’s important to have transparency into things governments do.

But I also worry that such requirements can lead to worse results. Generally in a well run organisation, you want people to be able to speak their mind and disagree about things, but if the organisation makes a bad decision and those disagreements are recorded, they will be used against them.

For an arbitrary example, look at the Boeing 737 max. There were some internal emails claiming that the system which turned out not to be safe wasn’t safe (the problem with these was probably that they didn’t seem to make their way up to anyone who could change the decision), and probably the fallout from them will be worse than if there were no such emails and Boeing just appeared to not have considered the possibility of failure. This gives the message that one shouldn’t have these discussions through email because that gives the impression that known issues were ignored if they turn out to have mattered. But no one asked about the cases where people had raised concerns by email and they were corrected by redesigning things or where concerns were raised but deemed to not be significant and turned out not to be significant. It seems better to me for people to be able to voice disagreements.

Another example is in healthcare: I suspect people get worse outcomes because if anyone has a different (potentially better) opinion about how a patient may be treated, they are incentivised not to voice it because any disagreement in a hospitals records will make for a much stronger case in any litigation against a hospital.

Perhaps the issue is that the media or public inquiries (or maybe courts or juries) will look at any such record as a sign of negligence rather than an ordinary thing which happens all the time in cases that go wrong and right.

But maybe signal is really being used for political scheming and some public business overflows onto signal unintentionally.

Re: UK government MPs are using Signal’s automatic deletion feature

#19

I think they ought to legislate this into normality. The alternative is to make it mandatory to note all conversations with colleagues for the public record, however trivial, which is obviously absurd. An IM conversation is a personal conversation, treating it any other way will stifle the effective function of government.

I disagree entirely. Government must be conducted openly and with critical review by the people being governed, always. All government business should be logged and available for audit for years after the fact.

Otherwise, what we get is a totalitarian class society divided between 'those that know the secrets' and 'those that do not'.

Re: UK government MPs are using Signal’s automatic deletion feature

#20
post #11
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The media used does does not affect the privacy/non-privacy of the discussion in any way.

But it does. There's no expectation on politicians to record and publish their face-to-face one-on-one conversations.

There should be such an expectation, though.
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