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In-person services may never operate strictly in-person again

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Re: In-person services may never operate strictly in-person again

#11

Post by triyambakam »

sitkack wrote: post #7
madengr wrote: post #5

My kids have been having their music lessons (cello & viola) remotely since the quarantine. For the advanced student, I can see 50% of lessons workable as remote, but not more than that. My kid may switch to every other lesson remote (two lessons per week at 45 minutes each). For the beginner, it doesn’t work that well, but I suppose it’s better than nothing.

But we need to figure out why the initial lessons are better in person than remote. It could be that small changes are needed in camera placement, or screens or something we haven't thought of. For many instruments you outline, it is how the bow or the instrument is held, this might be better online with the right tools, esp if you had multicamera pose estimation, it might not even need a teacher the majority of the…

Why do we _need_ to figure that out? Humans _need_ real in person interaction for health. I don't want to live one hundred percent of my life remotely.

Re: In-person services may never operate strictly in-person again

#12

Post by kortilla »

lykr0n wrote: post #8

I can't see myself wanting do continue doing anything remote when it's safe to stop. A lot of these articles are "we wern't doing this before COVID-19, but now we can't go out we're doing this remotely and therefor we're going to do this after the threat of COVID-19 disappears." I do like the increased options, but part of the reason I like to go visit my Therapist's office is that it's an office. I'm going to a diff…

Do you think that would be different if you lived in a place big enough for a dedicated office?

Re: In-person services may never operate strictly in-person again

#13

Post by learnstats2 »

sitkack wrote: post #7
madengr wrote: post #5

My kids have been having their music lessons (cello & viola) remotely since the quarantine. For the advanced student, I can see 50% of lessons workable as remote, but not more than that. My kid may switch to every other lesson remote (two lessons per week at 45 minutes each). For the beginner, it doesn’t work that well, but I suppose it’s better than nothing.

But we need to figure out why the initial lessons are better in person than remote. It could be that small changes are needed in camera placement, or screens or something we haven't thought of. For many instruments you outline, it is how the bow or the instrument is held, this might be better online with the right tools, esp if you had multicamera pose estimation, it might not even need a teacher the majority of the…

You're proposing essentially that the vast amount of skill that teachers have (as educators) can now be replaced by robots.

That wasn't the case before coronavirus and won't be the case afterwards.

The best robot teacher that exists is Duolingo, and I don't know a single person who has learned a language to a conversational level that way.

Re: In-person services may never operate strictly in-person again

#14

Post by LockAndLol »

> That being said, my whole team, myself included, are noticing that as we continue to provide Zoom sessions we’re getting better and better client sessions; we’re having breakthroughs all the time now.

Excuse me, but Zoom? How is that still allowed in healthcare? Are all privacy issues resolved?

Re: In-person services may never operate strictly in-person again

#16

Post by bavell »

sitkack wrote: post #7
madengr wrote: post #5

My kids have been having their music lessons (cello & viola) remotely since the quarantine. For the advanced student, I can see 50% of lessons workable as remote, but not more than that. My kid may switch to every other lesson remote (two lessons per week at 45 minutes each). For the beginner, it doesn’t work that well, but I suppose it’s better than nothing.

But we need to figure out why the initial lessons are better in person than remote. It could be that small changes are needed in camera placement, or screens or something we haven't thought of. For many instruments you outline, it is how the bow or the instrument is held, this might be better online with the right tools, esp if you had multicamera pose estimation, it might not even need a teacher the majority of the…

I think you're missing the obvious problem here. It's because nothing can replace having another human in the same room as you when it comes to learning and feedback.

Re: In-person services may never operate strictly in-person again

#18

Post by lykr0n »

kortilla wrote: post #12
lykr0n wrote: post #8

I can't see myself wanting do continue doing anything remote when it's safe to stop. A lot of these articles are "we wern't doing this before COVID-19, but now we can't go out we're doing this remotely and therefor we're going to do this after the threat of COVID-19 disappears." I do like the increased options, but part of the reason I like to go visit my Therapist's office is that it's an office. I'm going to a diff…

Do you think that would be different if you lived in a place big enough for a dedicated office?

It sure would make it better, and this WFH shit has made me start to looming for a larger place that can do this. But this doesn't scale for everyone- they either can't afford a larger place or the area can't support it.

The big thing for me is going some place else allows for a shifting of mindset. I don't want my therapist's office to be the same place where I work which is the same place I get doctors appointments

Re: In-person services may never operate strictly in-person again

#19

Post by Mediterraneo10 »

asveikau wrote: post #9
ars wrote: post #4

This seems like the biggest social transition since the always-connected cellphone/smartphone.

I don't understand why people are assuming this instead of the easier explanation of that (1) things will eventually bounce back and (2) somebody born in 1-2 generations will have no idea what the pandemic was like. As precedent, I cite the 1918 flu. In 1918 people were getting arrested for not wearing masks. The following decade was called "The Roaring '20s," and I don't presume it roared because of all the social d…

The Spanish Flu happened before the rise of the modern welfare states. Now that the state is responsible for healthcare in many developed nations, there is enormous pressure to keep the levels of infected low in order to avoid burdening the public health system. Also, it may be that today the elderly are such a crucial block for winning votes, that politicians are under pressure to show they are protecting the elderly even if a disease has less impact on younger demographics.

The incredibly strict rules which e.g. France and Belgium instituted during the lockdown struck me as extreme and an unprecedented limitation on citizens’ freedom, but the authorities must have felt that they absolutely had to take this action. The way the lockdown has proceeded shows that the state has the necessary police apparatus in place to enforce whatever hygiene rules they want. That level of decisiveness was not present during the Spanish Flu, and so things do not necessarily have to go back to normal.

Re: In-person services may never operate strictly in-person again

#20

Post by TeMPOraL »

learnstats2 wrote: post #13
sitkack wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But we need to figure out why the initial lessons are better in person than remote. It could be that small changes are needed in camera placement, or screens or something we haven't thought of. For many instruments you outline, it is how the bow or the instrument is held, this might be better online with the right tools, esp if you had multicamera pose estimation, it might not even need a teacher the majority of the…

You're proposing essentially that the vast amount of skill that teachers have (as educators) can now be replaced by robots. That wasn't the case before coronavirus and won't be the case afterwards. The best robot teacher that exists is Duolingo, and I don't know a single person who has learned a language to a conversational level that way.

Language and music aren't the same; arguably, the part of the class that involves learning how to hold an instrument correctly could be replaced by technology.

As for why this wasn't the case before coronavirus: there was no reason to. There wasn't good enough of a market. Now, there is, so perhaps some ideas from this situation will stick around for longer.

(Then again, I've heard numerous reports that in general, remote school classes are a huge dumpster fire. I don't expect any of that staying when the schools are allowed to reopen. But maybe the postmortems will bring some nuggets of insight about effective remote schooling.)

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