Shorten the Workweek to Reopen Safely • Hacker News Board

Re: Shorten the Workweek to Reopen Safely

#11

Post by tehjoker » Mon, May 04, 2020, 3:28 AM UTC

fiblye wrote: post #6

tehjoker wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm concerned that if we go this route on a permanent basis without a more powerful labor movement, it'll mean that work and home will seamlessly merge. Employer surveillance will enter the home and corporate domination will seep into every pore of our existence... and that's for white collar workers.

If work from home ends up really sticking around, I'm sure plenty of cost-cutting employers will expect everyone to buy their own computers, but expect employees to all install keyloggers and monitoring software in order to work. And people will accept it, because they'll be fired if they refuse and someone more desperate will deal with it so long as they get paid at some point.

I hate to always be that guy, but this is the sort of situation in which one might wield the strike, a coordinated worker action, to prevent home spyware from being installed. If you work within a framework of uncoordinated individual action, domination of the individual by the interests of the corporation is the logical result.

Re: Shorten the Workweek to Reopen Safely

#12

Post by djhaskin987 » Mon, May 04, 2020, 3:31 AM UTC

If everyone started working fewer hours for the same pay you would be effectively devaluing the dollar. You wouldn't actually be adding more value to the economy.

Value in the economy is created by work and there is simply no substitute for that. Shortening the work week would simply make less value in the economy, making us all poorer and more idle.

Too much idleness I can tell you leads to stress, even more stress than too much work. 40 hours is not too much work.

To solve the problem in the article one could still cut the workforce by half that was present in the office simply by adding more work-from-home time for the workers which I find to be healthy my own experience anyway. our office is made similar overtures, saying when we go back to work lots of us. Be working from home as a way to tackle a space issue.

Re: Shorten the Workweek to Reopen Safely

#13

Post by elliekelly » Mon, May 04, 2020, 3:43 AM UTC

djhaskin987 wrote: post #12

If everyone started working fewer hours for the same pay you would be effectively devaluing the dollar. You wouldn't actually be adding more value to the economy. Value in the economy is created by work and there is simply no substitute for that. Shortening the work week would simply make less value in the economy, making us all poorer and more idle. Too much idleness I can tell you leads to stress, even more stress…

Many people outside of Silicon Valley have temporarily (in theory) had their salaries cut. 20% less work for 25-30% less pay sounds like it devalues employee time far more than it devalues the dollar.

Re: Shorten the Workweek to Reopen Safely

#14

Post by daxfohl » Mon, May 04, 2020, 4:19 AM UTC

Anybody else feeling like if we're young and healthy we should actively try to contract this thing, self-isolate for a few weeks, and be done with it?

It feels almost like this would be the most socially responsible thing to do: reduce the effective R0 and allow things to start getting back to normality.

I'm the farthest thing from a "reopen" protester. But I can't help thinking that as a young and healthy individual, this is a valid option that nobody is talking about.

Re: Shorten the Workweek to Reopen Safely

#15

Post by forgot_my_pwd » Mon, May 04, 2020, 4:26 AM UTC

daxfohl wrote: post #14

Anybody else feeling like if we're young and healthy we should actively try to contract this thing, self-isolate for a few weeks, and be done with it? It feels almost like this would be the most socially responsible thing to do: reduce the effective R0 and allow things to start getting back to normality. I'm the farthest thing from a "reopen" protester. But I can't help thinking that as a young and healthy individual…

This has been my thinking for a few weeks now. Aside from bringing us significantly closer to herd immunity, it would increase the pool of eligible plasma donors for plasma antibody therapy.

And those are just the public health benefits. Saving millions of jobs and livelihoods is no small benefit either.

Re: Shorten the Workweek to Reopen Safely

#16

Post by TomMckenny » Mon, May 04, 2020, 4:27 AM UTC

GuB-42 wrote: post #8

Ok, good point, there is just one small detail: the "without cutting salaries" part. Employees will love it, that's for sure, but I don't think employers will get even. You are basically giving your employees a 25% raise on their hourly wage. There are success stories of companies that pay their employees above market value, either by paying them the same amount for less work, paying them more, or giving them particu…

Will there be objections from companies that have been part of the biggest stock rally in generations, large companies that took piles of the small business bail out money and, companies like Domino's that have thrived yet had to be forced to allow employees to wear even legally required masks?

Re: Shorten the Workweek to Reopen Safely

#17

Post by droopyEyelids » Mon, May 04, 2020, 4:29 AM UTC

daxfohl wrote: post #14

Anybody else feeling like if we're young and healthy we should actively try to contract this thing, self-isolate for a few weeks, and be done with it? It feels almost like this would be the most socially responsible thing to do: reduce the effective R0 and allow things to start getting back to normality. I'm the farthest thing from a "reopen" protester. But I can't help thinking that as a young and healthy individual…

This made sense when it seemed like the flu- where you get it, and you die or you get better, end of story.

Sars-2 is you get it, and then you get some amount of permanent damage to your lungs and cardiovascular system.

Re: Shorten the Workweek to Reopen Safely

#18

Post by SeeTheTruth » Mon, May 04, 2020, 4:31 AM UTC

daxfohl wrote: post #14

Anybody else feeling like if we're young and healthy we should actively try to contract this thing, self-isolate for a few weeks, and be done with it? It feels almost like this would be the most socially responsible thing to do: reduce the effective R0 and allow things to start getting back to normality. I'm the farthest thing from a "reopen" protester. But I can't help thinking that as a young and healthy individual…

NO. You risk spreading it, young and healthy people are still dying or having severe outcomes - we still don't know enough to predict how it will go.

And we still don't know if catching one strain once confers immunity, or for how long. So you won't be "done with it".

If you do get sick you become a burden on an overloaded healthcare system.

The people talking about this option are rightly being shut down.

Re: Shorten the Workweek to Reopen Safely

#19

Post by forgot_my_pwd » Mon, May 04, 2020, 4:34 AM UTC

How many of us don't want to commute to the office 5 days a week, but also don't necessarily like the idea of working from home when not at the office?

My personal ideal is a dedicated office space in a location very close to my home, like in the nearest downtown, where I would pay a certain amount per month in return for a set of days on which I could reserve personal office space.

The issue with working from home for me is that I feel my personal life and work life become messy and entangled if I do too much work at home. Similar to how good sleep hygiene involves doing as few activities other than sleeping on your bed as possible, I feel for my mental wellbeing it's better to physically separate my work life and home life as much as possible.

Re: Shorten the Workweek to Reopen Safely

#20

Post by gumby » Mon, May 04, 2020, 4:37 AM UTC

daxfohl wrote: post #14

Anybody else feeling like if we're young and healthy we should actively try to contract this thing, self-isolate for a few weeks, and be done with it? It feels almost like this would be the most socially responsible thing to do: reduce the effective R0 and allow things to start getting back to normality. I'm the farthest thing from a "reopen" protester. But I can't help thinking that as a young and healthy individual…

Young and healthy doesn’t guarantee you’ll survive the disease intact.