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Tolstoy’s Children’s Stories

lareviewofbooks.org

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Re: Tolstoy’s Children’s Stories

#11

Post by crazygringo »

> Tolstoy’s tales are unusual in that they lack the depth of relationships — and even hatred — that the old folk tales have. There are no stories of wicked stepparents or lurking dangers in the woods. Instead, there is a kind of dead-end romanticism: bad thing happens; a person is sad; end of story. There isn’t even that much to talk to your children about: trees are nice, don’t cut them down so much? People are not all that happy?

Wow. The author seems to be missing the morals entirely. Just from browsing their story descriptions, the lessons seem to be about, respectively:

- The overwhelming power of grief, which you may wind up suffering when you choose to love

- Don't be tricked by people trying to get you to enjoy yourself in a dangerous situation

- The feeling that makes you uncomfortable destroying beauty is a kind of conscience, so listen to it, for there is an intrinsic connection between beauty and life

- Happiness is misunderstood by nearly all -- it doesn't come from material possessions, it comes from within

- People are supported by those around them, not diminished, so don't treat those who surround you as unimportant or take them for granted

- If you tame an animal, you're responsible for their well-being. You can't "go back" or shirk your responsibilities, so think twice before you take on a personal commitment or you may generate suffering you never intended

Writers for the LA Review of Books are generally... supposed to be literary and really good at finding meaning in texts, heck even way more meaning than the author sometimes intended.

This author seems to be being deliberately obtuse about these stories. I'm not sure why. But these stories seem incredibly stimulating food-for-thought to talk with your children about.

Re: Tolstoy’s Children’s Stories

#12

Post by kick »

brummm wrote: post #7
ginko wrote: post #4

This seems to be pretty much par for the course for 19th century children's books. Compare them to the original versions of H.C. Andersen's fairy tales or Hoffmann's Struwwelpeter[1]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Struwwelpeter

My gandma used to read the Struwwelpeter stories to me as a child. I would actually disagree with the premise of the article that they make children want to die. They actually are supposed to frighten children into behaving properly.

"Tolstoy's Children's Stories Will Devastate Your Children and Make You Want to Die"

Re: Tolstoy’s Children’s Stories

#13

Post by rosstex » 

    Rock-a-bye baby, on the treetop.
    When the wind blows, the cradle will rock.
    When the bough breaks, the cradle will fall.
    And down will come Baby, cradle and all.
or

    It’s raining, it’s pouring,
    The old man’s snoring.
    He went to bed
    And he bumped his head
    And he couldn’t get up in the morning.
Tell me these ain't dark.

Re: Tolstoy’s Children’s Stories

#15

Post by krick »

riazrizvi wrote: post #6

I think classic folk tales were more macabre, but since consumers today are not interested in them so much it's somewhat lost to us. We have Grimm's Fairy Stories, but as the author points out, in most modern editions they edit out the darker ones. We have this Tolstoy collection because he is a famous author and people are interested in his stories. And guess what, they are super dark. Is that because Tolstoy was da…

> in most modern editions they edit out the darker ones

Yeah, it's disgusting. It's incredibly hard to find actual stories now, they are always screwed up by talentless editors. Reminds me of drawing fig leaves over Renaissance pictures when protestantism took over.

Re: Tolstoy’s Children’s Stories

#16

Post by brummm »

alpaca128 wrote: post #9
brummm wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My gandma used to read the Struwwelpeter stories to me as a child. I would actually disagree with the premise of the article that they make children want to die. They actually are supposed to frighten children into behaving properly.

I actually enjoyed the stories back then and they didn't really work when it came to changing my behaviour. Probably mostly because I just didn't grasp the seriousness of the bloodier parts.

The one that would always stick out to me was the one of the child that doesn't want to eat its soup and then dies (Suppenkasper).

Re: Tolstoy’s Children’s Stories

#17

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0 »

brummm wrote: post #7
ginko wrote: post #4

This seems to be pretty much par for the course for 19th century children's books. Compare them to the original versions of H.C. Andersen's fairy tales or Hoffmann's Struwwelpeter[1]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Struwwelpeter

My gandma used to read the Struwwelpeter stories to me as a child. I would actually disagree with the premise of the article that they make children want to die. They actually are supposed to frighten children into behaving properly.

I am willing to agree. I read Grimm really early. The purpose of those stories is not some sort of cutesy money grab slash temporary babysitter to keep the little ones occupied long enough for parents to do what needs to be done. That said, I understand the reason for both. Both are needed, but dismissing those stories, because they are scaring kids is.. it feels like a rehash of the self-esteem movement.

Re: Tolstoy’s Children’s Stories

#18

Post by user982 »

ginko wrote: post #4

This seems to be pretty much par for the course for 19th century children's books. Compare them to the original versions of H.C. Andersen's fairy tales or Hoffmann's Struwwelpeter[1]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Struwwelpeter

When you say “the original versions of H.C. Andersen's fairy tales,” you mean as compared to modern (Disney) adaptations, right? I know the Grimm tales were self-sanitized in later editions, but haven’t heard that of Andersen's.

Re: Tolstoy’s Children’s Stories

#19

Post by [deleted] »

rosstex wrote: post #13

Rock-a-bye baby, on the treetop. When the wind blows, the cradle will rock. When the bough breaks, the cradle will fall. And down will come Baby, cradle and all. or It’s raining, it’s pouring, The old man’s snoring. He went to bed And he bumped his head And he couldn’t get up in the morning. Tell me these ain't dark.

[deleted]

Re: Tolstoy’s Children’s Stories

#20

Post by fennecfoxen »

riazrizvi wrote: post #6

I think classic folk tales were more macabre, but since consumers today are not interested in them so much it's somewhat lost to us. We have Grimm's Fairy Stories, but as the author points out, in most modern editions they edit out the darker ones. We have this Tolstoy collection because he is a famous author and people are interested in his stories. And guess what, they are super dark. Is that because Tolstoy was da…

Hmm. I think I saw this one as _The Juniper Tree_ in which the kid comes back as a bird first.

  My mother, she killed me, my father, he ate me,
  My sister Marlene gathered all my bones,
  Tied them in a silken scarf,
  Laid them beneath the juniper tree,
  Tweet, tweet, what a beautiful bird am I.
(Grimm 47, Aarne–Thompson type 720, "my mother slew me, my father ate me")

Remember that plenty of the original Grimm stories had been meant to entertain adults, too.

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