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If you're not failing you're not trying.

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Re: If you're not failing you're not trying.

#11
post #2

I find the notion of failing as something that should be aspired to worrisome. Often the cost of failure is too high. You don't want an airliner-pilot to seek failure. If banks make a big mistake and we slide into recession, people loose jobs, should we pat them on the shoulder for trying? What about the judge that sends an innocent man to prison? What about the solider that accidentally shoots an unarmed man? Can we…

It is not about professional activities. I do not expect airline pilot to try new tricks fully loaded with passengers, but I appreciate Wrights brothers efforts to try to put the man in the air in the first place. If they were afraid to try, if hundreds of others who tried it before them and failed were afraid to try, we could be still dreaming about flying.

Bit it's not about innovation either. It's about pedestrian activities which one is afraid to take because of fear of failure. It could be going to play football with friends after 20 years of not playing. It could be trying to ride the first bike a kid got in front of his neighbours. It could be starting your own business. It could be anything one would like to do but his fear of failure stops him.

It's not about taking stupid risks (the airline pilot). It's about calculated risks and eliminating public failure as something one consider critically harmful. If your failure could cost you $1000 and some public exposure and it's the reason you won't try, but you would try if it'd cost you $2000 without public exposure - well, that's what this post is about. To learn to put less "value" on public exposure of your failures so that you'd stop considering it being such a big cost of potential failure.

Re: If you're not failing you're not trying.

#12

i was just reading about this today in "Rework", about failing in obscurity. similar notion to failing at something mundane with the M&M's. relish the opportunity you have while operating in obscurity, to fail as often as you can so you can adjust and learn and tweak and process all the data that comes with that. also reminds me of the zuckerberg quote: "unless you are breaking stuff, you are not moving fast enough."…

I had never heard that zuckerberg quote before but I love it do you remember where you got it from?

on startup quote: http://startupquote.com/post/1624569753

Re: If you're not failing you're not trying.

#14

i was just reading about this today in "Rework", about failing in obscurity. similar notion to failing at something mundane with the M&M's. relish the opportunity you have while operating in obscurity, to fail as often as you can so you can adjust and learn and tweak and process all the data that comes with that. also reminds me of the zuckerberg quote: "unless you are breaking stuff, you are not moving fast enough."…

I had never heard that zuckerberg quote before but I love it do you remember where you got it from?

Saved on evernote thanks

Re: If you're not failing you're not trying.

#16
post #2

I find the notion of failing as something that should be aspired to worrisome. Often the cost of failure is too high. You don't want an airliner-pilot to seek failure. If banks make a big mistake and we slide into recession, people loose jobs, should we pat them on the shoulder for trying? What about the judge that sends an innocent man to prison? What about the solider that accidentally shoots an unarmed man? Can we…

You need to manage your risk. Without a risk management strategy, failure is likely to be worse. Obviously a pilot won't blindly seek failure to improve (I'll head for that mountain to see how well this baby handles crash landing). '...accidently...' - A lot can learnt (and mitigated against) from accidents.

I agree it's not black and white, but I think failure is more stark and thus sticks with us, helping us to grow.

Re: If you're not failing you're not trying.

#17
I don't agree with this whole glorification-of-failure stuff that is posted occasionally.

It's not that I see failure as particularly bad, or horrible. It's that it's not the point. The point is to WIN. When you launch a startup, and fail, try again. But wouldn't it have been better to succeed? Isn't the point to make money, or build a platform, or win the game? Not every product has a market. Not every customer call will result in a sale. But the point is to make a winner.

Why would you purposely seek out failure?

Of course, the undercurrent here is that in order to succeed - in order to win big - you must risk a lot, and risk failure. Risking failure is necessary. Making mistakes happens. If you're not risking failure or humiliation, you're not playing the best game you can.

Risking failure is not the same as actually failing.

Maybe that's just semantics, but it is a very important difference. If you're purposely seeking failure, I feel sorry for you.

Re: If you're not failing you're not trying.

#18
post #17

I don't agree with this whole glorification-of-failure stuff that is posted occasionally. It's not that I see failure as particularly bad, or horrible. It's that it's not the point. The point is to WIN. When you launch a startup, and fail, try again. But wouldn't it have been better to succeed? Isn't the point to make money, or build a platform, or win the game? Not every product has a market. Not every customer call…

Thanks for sharing your thoughts and I see your point, and I think that all of us have the goal of winning in mind. Of course it would be better to just succeed right off the bat. But that's not realistic. Success is a process.

This post wasn't really about seeking out failure as it was about recognizing that we have limitations and taking that as a challenge to overcome them. It was also about further realizing that failure at something isn't necessarily an indictment of your ability to succeed but a sign that you are pushing yourself sufficiently that if you keep learning from your mistakes you WILL succeed eventually.

Re: If you're not failing you're not trying.

#19
post #2

I find the notion of failing as something that should be aspired to worrisome. Often the cost of failure is too high. You don't want an airliner-pilot to seek failure. If banks make a big mistake and we slide into recession, people loose jobs, should we pat them on the shoulder for trying? What about the judge that sends an innocent man to prison? What about the solider that accidentally shoots an unarmed man? Can we…

But that airline pilot has been failing on a regular basis for years.

He learned to fly in a little single engine plane, and routinely recovered it from stalls and even spins. His instructor would have him close his eyes, then throw the plane out of balance and have him attempt to correct it by feel (and he'd often fail to do so). He's crashed that very jet you're riding in dozens or even hundreds of times in the simulator. He's even recovered a real one from a stall during his certification.

The only reason he's good enough to be trusted to fly with you in the back is because he's been training to failure all those years.

Re: If you're not failing you're not trying.

#20
Real world example: Rock Climbing

There are two basic approaches to route climbing with ropes: "Traditional Climbing" with removable gear placed as the rock allows and the potential for injury if you were to fall, and "Sport Climbing", with closely spaced fixed gear, where falling is a matter of course.

"Trad" climbers will often go years, decades, entire careers without ever falling off the rock. "Sport" climbers will average around a dozen good falls on a typical day out.

So there you have two observable groups, one where failure is not an option, the other where failure is commonplace. Given the difference in mindset, it's not surprising that you'll often see 14 year old kids with one year of experience in a world where falling is just part of the game out-climbing men with 20 years experience who've never truly exceeded their limits.

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