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Charlie Munger: ‘The Phone Is Not Ringing Off the Hook’

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Re: Charlie Munger: ‘The Phone Is Not Ringing Off the Hook’

#11

Post by minikites »

pmiller2 wrote: post #4

This quote from Munger is what I find most interesting: > I do think, sooner or later, we’ll have an economy back, which will be a moderate economy. It’s quite possible that never again—not again in a long time—will we have a level of employment again like we just lost. We may never get that back for all practical purposes. I don’t know. There are roughly 2 ways this could go if what he says actually happens. One is…

I have a pessimistic view about this aspect of the future and I think your first option is vastly more likely. We have too many people who have their entire self worth wrapped up in their employment, too many people who look down on the very concept of being unemployed (i.e. "Protestant work ethic"), and in the USA, racial divisions complicating the matter tremendously.

The best I can hope for is a reduction in the number of people who open a conversation with a stranger with "So, what do you do for a living?" as if that's the most important or interesting question to ask someone.

Re: Charlie Munger: ‘The Phone Is Not Ringing Off the Hook’

#12

Post by bob33212 »

pmiller2 wrote: post #4

This quote from Munger is what I find most interesting: > I do think, sooner or later, we’ll have an economy back, which will be a moderate economy. It’s quite possible that never again—not again in a long time—will we have a level of employment again like we just lost. We may never get that back for all practical purposes. I don’t know. There are roughly 2 ways this could go if what he says actually happens. One is…

I think the general public is open to the idea of taking care of folks who lost their jobs. The problem is drawing the line. If a taxi company goes bankrupt a lot of folks would expect the taxi drivers to start driving for Uber. If ESPN has to layoff some staff how long should they get help? Should they be expected to look for tangential jobs?

Re: Charlie Munger: ‘The Phone Is Not Ringing Off the Hook’

#13

Post by bravo22 »

jacquesm wrote: post #7
pmiller2 wrote: post #4

This quote from Munger is what I find most interesting: > I do think, sooner or later, we’ll have an economy back, which will be a moderate economy. It’s quite possible that never again—not again in a long time—will we have a level of employment again like we just lost. We may never get that back for all practical purposes. I don’t know. There are roughly 2 ways this could go if what he says actually happens. One is…

The whole idea that 'being social' equates to 'socialism', the bogeyman edition is what will stop for instance the United States from adopting a more social agenda. Free - or at least affordable - public healthcare, public transportation, internet access and access to things like clean water should be a basic standard of living for any country that does not want to be labelled 'third world'. Instead, that whole agend…

The 'ism' is about control, not about benefit.

Philosophically I agree that we need a better system the benefits everyone, and I agree with the gist of your comment.

However saying we need socialism skips over the most important part of it -- the mechanism to achieve that. That's the hard part that we haven't quite figured out and need to discuss. The current narrative assumes that simply funnelling the money through government for redistribution fixes the problem. It doesn't. It makes things a lot worse.

Re: Charlie Munger: ‘The Phone Is Not Ringing Off the Hook’

#14

Post by minikites »

ctdonath wrote: post #9
jacquesm wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole idea that 'being social' equates to 'socialism', the bogeyman edition is what will stop for instance the United States from adopting a more social agenda. Free - or at least affordable - public healthcare, public transportation, internet access and access to things like clean water should be a basic standard of living for any country that does not want to be labelled 'third world'. Instead, that whole agend…

The USA is effectively 50 countries with different demographics, geography, culture, and needs. Trying to impose any “one size fits all” solution won’t work because it’s not appropriate for a significant number of them.

Where is "access to clean water" (or frankly, anything on the list) not appropriate?

Re: Charlie Munger: ‘The Phone Is Not Ringing Off the Hook’

#15

Post by [deleted] »

pmiller2 wrote: post #10
toomuchtodo wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was the right decision at the time. It's unlikely anyone could've predicted the Federal Reserve and the Treasury Dept would've stepped in with unlimited support before the recent self-imposed economic collapse.

They announced their intention to offer bonds in late March, well after it was generally known that the government intended to step in.

[deleted]

Re: Charlie Munger: ‘The Phone Is Not Ringing Off the Hook’

#16

Post by mattwad »

bob33212 wrote: post #12
pmiller2 wrote: post #4

This quote from Munger is what I find most interesting: > I do think, sooner or later, we’ll have an economy back, which will be a moderate economy. It’s quite possible that never again—not again in a long time—will we have a level of employment again like we just lost. We may never get that back for all practical purposes. I don’t know. There are roughly 2 ways this could go if what he says actually happens. One is…

I think the general public is open to the idea of taking care of folks who lost their jobs. The problem is drawing the line. If a taxi company goes bankrupt a lot of folks would expect the taxi drivers to start driving for Uber. If ESPN has to layoff some staff how long should they get help? Should they be expected to look for tangential jobs?

If helping some people that don't need it gets us to fix the issue for ones in need, who cares if a few people get extra help? Somehow, the Republican party, which uses this argument all the time, is fine with helping millionaires get millions in tax breaks when trying to help buttress the economy, then why do we care if some individual gets unneccessary food stamps? We have never just tried safety nets, because the conversations is too worried about what abuse COULD happen. But it's only about abuse by the little guy; no one cares about the tax loop holes being abused by people that don't need it in the first place.

Re: Charlie Munger: ‘The Phone Is Not Ringing Off the Hook’

#17

Post by toomuchtodo »

pmiller2 wrote: post #10
toomuchtodo wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was the right decision at the time. It's unlikely anyone could've predicted the Federal Reserve and the Treasury Dept would've stepped in with unlimited support before the recent self-imposed economic collapse.

They announced their intention to offer bonds in late March, well after it was generally known that the government intended to step in.

I don't believe it was until early April when the full force of support was evident.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22822869

Re: Charlie Munger: ‘The Phone Is Not Ringing Off the Hook’

#18

Post by pmiller2 »

jacquesm wrote: post #7
pmiller2 wrote: post #4

This quote from Munger is what I find most interesting: > I do think, sooner or later, we’ll have an economy back, which will be a moderate economy. It’s quite possible that never again—not again in a long time—will we have a level of employment again like we just lost. We may never get that back for all practical purposes. I don’t know. There are roughly 2 ways this could go if what he says actually happens. One is…

The whole idea that 'being social' equates to 'socialism', the bogeyman edition is what will stop for instance the United States from adopting a more social agenda. Free - or at least affordable - public healthcare, public transportation, internet access and access to things like clean water should be a basic standard of living for any country that does not want to be labelled 'third world'. Instead, that whole agend…

I know. People have this idea that "socialism is when the government does stuff," if you'll excuse me in referencing a meme. They think Scandinavia is socialist because it has those things, but it is not: Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland, and Iceland are really social democracies. That is, they're capitalist countries with strong regulation and a social safety net.

I'm not entirely sure whether full on socialism will ever happen in the US short of total collapse and reconstruction, but we can certainly take steps toward social democracy. Unfortunately, the major parties in power don't want to do that, instead pushing forward their laissez-faire neoliberal agenda.

The real problem here is first past the post voting, and the way election law is structured to keep the 2 major parties in power. We need to get rid of first past the post and reform election law before we can make any real changes.

Re: Charlie Munger: ‘The Phone Is Not Ringing Off the Hook’

#19

Post by pmiller2 »

minikites wrote: post #14
ctdonath wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The USA is effectively 50 countries with different demographics, geography, culture, and needs. Trying to impose any “one size fits all” solution won’t work because it’s not appropriate for a significant number of them.

Where is "access to clean water" (or frankly, anything on the list) not appropriate?

I think the charitable interpretation of the comment you're replying to is that we may need ~50 different implementations of "access to clean water," etc.

Re: Charlie Munger: ‘The Phone Is Not Ringing Off the Hook’

#20

Post by kick »

ctdonath wrote: post #9
jacquesm wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole idea that 'being social' equates to 'socialism', the bogeyman edition is what will stop for instance the United States from adopting a more social agenda. Free - or at least affordable - public healthcare, public transportation, internet access and access to things like clean water should be a basic standard of living for any country that does not want to be labelled 'third world'. Instead, that whole agend…

The USA is effectively 50 countries with different demographics, geography, culture, and needs. Trying to impose any “one size fits all” solution won’t work because it’s not appropriate for a significant number of them.

The USA is a single country with what's effectively two demographics, and one-and-a-half breeds of politician.

"50 countries with different demographics geography culture and needs!" is a complete fabrication. Wyoming doesn't even have a million people in it; implying Wyoming is a country is like implying a go-kart is a jet.

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