Live data from Hacker News

Alcoholics Anonymous vs. other approaches: the evidence is now in

nytimes.com

11–20 of 366 posts

Re: Alcoholics Anonymous vs. other approaches: the evidence is now in

#11
post #4
post #2

It's refreshing to see people helping people in programs like AA. I'm curious to see if the success of these programs change in the coming decades, as younger generations seem to be moving away from social interaction in favor of social MEDIA interaction. Will this have an impact on the success of programs like AA? I hope not.

You could always have an AA meeting in VR Chat. In fact, I'd be surprised if there isn't one.

Doing it virtually makes it hard to retain the "anonymous" part of AA.

Re: Alcoholics Anonymous vs. other approaches: the evidence is now in

#12
It's the community. Half the members of AA can't even name all the steps, but in AA they find kinship with other people with similar experiences and similar struggles.

Humans are hyper-social. We live better, grow better, heal better, and confront difficulties better when we have others. This is true for introverts too. Introverts are not anti-social, they just have a more muted less intense social style.

Re: Alcoholics Anonymous vs. other approaches: the evidence is now in

#13
I completely agree with the message that people-helping people is super effective.

But I'd like to point out that one of the core tenants of AA is to surrender to a higher power.

I'm not advocating in favor of religion. But rather highlighting that maybe people who accept 'surrender' of their own will are more likely to get better. There's something to the concept that seems powerful.

Anecdotally, I've known someone who used to be stressed out and controlling. Last time I saw him he was not so stressed. He said his life changed once he surrendered and accepted his destiny. He didn't go religious or anything, just 'accepted' his fate.

It reminds me of the old saying: The reasonable man adapts himself to the world, the unreasonable man adapts the world to himself, therefore all progress is due to the unreasonable man.

Re: Alcoholics Anonymous vs. other approaches: the evidence is now in

#14
post #11
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could always have an AA meeting in VR Chat. In fact, I'd be surprised if there isn't one.

Doing it virtually makes it hard to retain the "anonymous" part of AA.

The "anonymous" part of AA is really disingenuous if you stick with the program. People get to know each other pretty well.

Re: Alcoholics Anonymous vs. other approaches: the evidence is now in

#15
post #11
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could always have an AA meeting in VR Chat. In fact, I'd be surprised if there isn't one.

Doing it virtually makes it hard to retain the "anonymous" part of AA.

i feel like it would be easier to retain anonymity in VR vs a physical location where you could be recorded in, or have your car spotted, or have any of the other participants remember your face.

Re: Alcoholics Anonymous vs. other approaches: the evidence is now in

#16
post #7

Anecdotally, self-help is an effective approach not mentioned in the article.

I agree, but having attended AA meetings to support my significant other I can really see how the groups and meetings help. For the people like you and me who can work through it ourselves, there will be a hundred who can't and where the program helps. Personally I have an issue with giving up control absolutely as it is worded, since I like to be in control of my destiny, but I respect and appreciate the wonders that AA can work for people.

Re: Alcoholics Anonymous vs. other approaches: the evidence is now in

#17
post #7

Anecdotally, self-help is an effective approach not mentioned in the article.

It works for a lot of people. For many people, particularly the worst cases, it does not. Most people who end up in AA have tried self-help already.

Re: Alcoholics Anonymous vs. other approaches: the evidence is now in

#18
post #11
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could always have an AA meeting in VR Chat. In fact, I'd be surprised if there isn't one.

Doing it virtually makes it hard to retain the "anonymous" part of AA.

That isn't how the anonymous part of alcoholics anonymous works. The twelve traditions lay out a better explanation, I think, but you are not totally anonymous in the group meeting, use of first names only when speaking and interacting, but friendships evolve from that.

Quick edit: The Twelve Traditions of Alcoholics Anonymous: https://www.aa.org/assets/en_US/smf-122_en.pdf

Re: Alcoholics Anonymous vs. other approaches: the evidence is now in

#19

I completely agree with the message that people-helping people is super effective. But I'd like to point out that one of the core tenants of AA is to surrender to a higher power. I'm not advocating in favor of religion. But rather highlighting that maybe people who accept 'surrender' of their own will are more likely to get better. There's something to the concept that seems powerful. Anecdotally, I've known someone…

Lord grant me the reasonableness to adapt to the things I cannot change and the unreasonableness to adapt to myself the things I can.

Re: Alcoholics Anonymous vs. other approaches: the evidence is now in

#20

I completely agree with the message that people-helping people is super effective. But I'd like to point out that one of the core tenants of AA is to surrender to a higher power. I'm not advocating in favor of religion. But rather highlighting that maybe people who accept 'surrender' of their own will are more likely to get better. There's something to the concept that seems powerful. Anecdotally, I've known someone…

I think there's a major understanding of this part of AA. This DOES NOT mean acknowledging that you believe there is a god. The concept of a "higher power" can mean anything you want it to mean. You can imagine your higher power is Gandalf, Sauron, elves at the bottom of the garden, or even some aspect of your "best self." You could imagine it to be the spirits of your ancestors or even something like the energy of the universe.

The point is surrendering to something "bigger" than yourself. Don't get tied up in militant atheist perspectives.

Post reply on HN