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Trial of programmer accused in CIA leak ends in hung jury

nytimes.com

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Re: Trial of programmer accused in CIA leak ends in hung jury

#11

Post by staticautomatic »

meowface wrote: post #7
undreren wrote: post #3

I'm not much of a conspiracy theorist, but it seems awfully convenient that a guy that knows how to nuke his hard disk to protect himself from the CIA, only nukes the the hard disk he downloaded the WikiLeaks transfer program on, and then forgets to nuke the hard disk riddled with child porn.

Certainly seems odd, but it's not like the guy's dead or something. First, it was stored in a VeraCrypt encrypted container; if he believed only he had the keys, he may have thought it was safe. If he believes he was being framed for child pornography, I imagine he would shout it from the rooftops. Or at least try to shout it to the extent he could, to the point that there would probably be at least a little coverage…

I don't have any comment on the truth of the factual assertions. And I don't know how common it is for feds to actually plant evidence these days or in these kinds of cases, but in my experience it is relatively common for federal prosecutors to over-charge suspects, make shit up outright, lob salacious accusations that they know perfectly well aren't supported by evidence, conceal evidence from grand juries which they know would jeopardize their chances of securing an indictment, knowingly conceal exculpatory evidence, and deliberately misstate the nature of evidence, among other things. Source: Myself; I consult on litigation for a living, including criminal cases ranging from misdemeanor drug possession to white collar to murder one.

Re: Trial of programmer accused in CIA leak ends in hung jury

#12

Post by crowtoe76 »

undreren wrote: post #3

I'm not much of a conspiracy theorist, but it seems awfully convenient that a guy that knows how to nuke his hard disk to protect himself from the CIA, only nukes the the hard disk he downloaded the WikiLeaks transfer program on, and then forgets to nuke the hard disk riddled with child porn.

To contemplate the actions of the CIA is to be a "conspiracy theorist". What does the CIA do all day, every day, besides "conspire"?

Re: Trial of programmer accused in CIA leak ends in hung jury

#13

Post by frandroid »

meowface wrote: post #7
undreren wrote: post #3

I'm not much of a conspiracy theorist, but it seems awfully convenient that a guy that knows how to nuke his hard disk to protect himself from the CIA, only nukes the the hard disk he downloaded the WikiLeaks transfer program on, and then forgets to nuke the hard disk riddled with child porn.

Certainly seems odd, but it's not like the guy's dead or something. First, it was stored in a VeraCrypt encrypted container; if he believed only he had the keys, he may have thought it was safe. If he believes he was being framed for child pornography, I imagine he would shout it from the rooftops. Or at least try to shout it to the extent he could, to the point that there would probably be at least a little coverage…

> I could see the argument that it was a morbid curiosity for him rather than out of pedophilic urges

Possession is illegal either way...

Re: Trial of programmer accused in CIA leak ends in hung jury

#15

Post by nl »

meowface wrote: post #7
undreren wrote: post #3

I'm not much of a conspiracy theorist, but it seems awfully convenient that a guy that knows how to nuke his hard disk to protect himself from the CIA, only nukes the the hard disk he downloaded the WikiLeaks transfer program on, and then forgets to nuke the hard disk riddled with child porn.

Certainly seems odd, but it's not like the guy's dead or something. First, it was stored in a VeraCrypt encrypted container; if he believed only he had the keys, he may have thought it was safe. If he believes he was being framed for child pornography, I imagine he would shout it from the rooftops. Or at least try to shout it to the extent he could, to the point that there would probably be at least a little coverage…

I agree with this entirely.

I think conspiracy theories are so dangerous because the threads can be interpreted however one wants, and facts don't matter.

You wrote a thoughtful, sensible rebuttal, but it has little impact in the face of "oh of course the CIA did it". It's pretty disappointing really.

Re: Trial of programmer accused in CIA leak ends in hung jury

#16

Post by meowface »

bilekas wrote: post #10
undreren wrote: post #3

I'm not much of a conspiracy theorist, but it seems awfully convenient that a guy that knows how to nuke his hard disk to protect himself from the CIA, only nukes the the hard disk he downloaded the WikiLeaks transfer program on, and then forgets to nuke the hard disk riddled with child porn.

I don't think it's a stretch to be honest, the thing is, while he might be completely guilty of leaking and the CIA know just can't prove. He wen't up against the CIA. This is a body who has the ability (allegedly of course) to restructure other governments. If it is a bogus charge.. Would anyone here really be surprised ? I mean really ? I don't think the people who would say : 'Nah wouldn't surprise me' are tinfoil…

Would I be surprised some people in the CIA would want to do such a thing? No.

Would I be surprised they'd do something so stupid as to plant child pornography on a suspect's computer and ruin their already pretty soiled reputation to such an extent that all future prosecutions of whistleblowers and leakers will come under heavy doubt, in addition to their ethics around abused children, and that this would be signed off by the top leadership and accepted organizationally? Kind of.

Re: Trial of programmer accused in CIA leak ends in hung jury

#17

Post by meowface »

crowtoe76 wrote: post #12
undreren wrote: post #3

I'm not much of a conspiracy theorist, but it seems awfully convenient that a guy that knows how to nuke his hard disk to protect himself from the CIA, only nukes the the hard disk he downloaded the WikiLeaks transfer program on, and then forgets to nuke the hard disk riddled with child porn.

To contemplate the actions of the CIA is to be a "conspiracy theorist". What does the CIA do all day, every day, besides "conspire"?

To speak of conveniences and "cui bono?" instead of disinterested analysis of the evidence is to be a conspiracy theorist. Of course they conspire all day, because any covert action can be called a conspiracy. It doesn't necessarily lead one to think they're conspiracies in the sense of planting child pornography on a US citizen suspect's computer.

One can't rule anything out when you're dealing with intelligence agencies, but in this case, is there a single known instance of the US government ever doing such a thing? Planting child pornography on a defendant's computer? Imagine dealing with the optics from that fallout; not only seeking out and spreading content of children being raped, but also using it to falsely imprison someone. I suspect nearly all CIA agents are far more comfortable with assassinating foreign adversaries than doing that.

Of course it could happen, but such a claim requires evidence, or at least some attempt at refuting the prosecution's claimed evidence, not just "well, you can't trust the CIA, you know".

Re: Trial of programmer accused in CIA leak ends in hung jury

#18

Post by meowface »

frandroid wrote: post #13
meowface wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Certainly seems odd, but it's not like the guy's dead or something. First, it was stored in a VeraCrypt encrypted container; if he believed only he had the keys, he may have thought it was safe. If he believes he was being framed for child pornography, I imagine he would shout it from the rooftops. Or at least try to shout it to the extent he could, to the point that there would probably be at least a little coverage…

> I could see the argument that it was a morbid curiosity for him rather than out of pedophilic urges Possession is illegal either way...

I added a paragraph about that. Of course it's illegal, and I personally think from an ethical standpoint that he should face criminal consequences either way, but there may be mitigating factors, and it may not be like how the government is portraying him in the complaint (essentially like a prolific predator and distributor). This could play a big role in sentencing, if it's true that there are those mitigating factors.

Re: Trial of programmer accused in CIA leak ends in hung jury

#19

Post by meowface »

AtHeartEngineer wrote: post #9
undreren wrote: post #3

I'm not much of a conspiracy theorist, but it seems awfully convenient that a guy that knows how to nuke his hard disk to protect himself from the CIA, only nukes the the hard disk he downloaded the WikiLeaks transfer program on, and then forgets to nuke the hard disk riddled with child porn.

Ya it seems a lot of cases have child porn and I just don't believe it's that prolific, seems real shady

How many cases? What are the statistics? Or could you link a few cases, anecdotally?

Re: Trial of programmer accused in CIA leak ends in hung jury

#20

Post by kick »

bilekas wrote: post #10
undreren wrote: post #3

I'm not much of a conspiracy theorist, but it seems awfully convenient that a guy that knows how to nuke his hard disk to protect himself from the CIA, only nukes the the hard disk he downloaded the WikiLeaks transfer program on, and then forgets to nuke the hard disk riddled with child porn.

I don't think it's a stretch to be honest, the thing is, while he might be completely guilty of leaking and the CIA know just can't prove. He wen't up against the CIA. This is a body who has the ability (allegedly of course) to restructure other governments. If it is a bogus charge.. Would anyone here really be surprised ? I mean really ? I don't think the people who would say : 'Nah wouldn't surprise me' are tinfoil…

Allegedly? They've admitted to causing the coup d'état in Chile.
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