Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

How the CIA Overthrew Iran's Democracy in Four Days in 1953 (2019)

npr.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 186 posts

Re: How the CIA Overthrew Iran's Democracy in Four Days in 1953 (2019)

#11

Post by ianai »

thdrdt wrote: post #7

Most western people are very negative about countries like Iran, China and Russia because they are the 'bad guys'. Well this article again shows that there are few countries that will not gain power over dead people. It's sad but true. Now imagine you were living in Iran and came to know about the work of the CIA. Whould you think the USA is the greatest country in the world and democracy is the way to go? I think it…

How do you assess the POV of someone under a regime of control and propaganda from dictators or tyrants? Assume they’re suffering and just hoping for a better tomorrow and you might be wrong. Hostages are known to grow emotions for their captors, after all. And outside attacks on groups lead to in-group insulation and doubling down on beliefs. Studying cultists has shown this trend.

So I don’t know. One thing a lot of these regimes have in common is oil wealth. Oil wealth tends to drive any other industries out of a country, insulate power around the ruling class, and lead to dictatorships and similar. Definitely getting humanity to use non oil energy sources ASAP would help lower the pressures, I hope.

Re: How the CIA Overthrew Iran's Democracy in Four Days in 1953 (2019)

#12

Post by missosoup »

thdrdt wrote: post #7

Most western people are very negative about countries like Iran, China and Russia because they are the 'bad guys'. Well this article again shows that there are few countries that will not gain power over dead people. It's sad but true. Now imagine you were living in Iran and came to know about the work of the CIA. Whould you think the USA is the greatest country in the world and democracy is the way to go? I think it…

China is harassing all of its coastal neighbours and trying to politically infiltrate just about every major country on the face of the earth.

Russia is invading neighbours, actively escalating military tensions and sabre rattling.

They don't really fit the same profile as Iran currently does.

Feel free to walk me through the 'good guy' point of view of the people who invaded my home country, shot down a passenger plane, and got away with complete impunity.

There are no good or bad guys. All the superpwers are dicks, that's how they got to being superpwers.

Re: How the CIA Overthrew Iran's Democracy in Four Days in 1953 (2019)

#13

Post by ianai »

ossworkerrights wrote: post #8
asplake wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

... and we’re dependent instead on rare earth elements and the like

Indeed, one step at a time tho.

I wish society required manufacturers to provide reclamation of the resources used in their discarded products. Ie when I’m done with my car battery the lithium is reclaimed from it for future use by someone with all the info and resources necessary to do it efficiently. Make the regulation such that recycling is factored into the design process.

Re: How the CIA Overthrew Iran's Democracy in Four Days in 1953 (2019)

#14

Post by elfexec »

ossworkerrights wrote: post #2

Curious how world politics will change once electric vehicles become mainstream and there is little need for oil.

It's not about oil necessarily. It's about energy source or more generally - a valuable resource. If lithium batteries become the new "oil", then lithium rich countries will become targets and oil countries will be ignored. But I think oil will be valuable for many decades to come. Oil use is projected to increase worldwide by every regulatory body.

As long as oil is valuable, we'll fight over it. If lithium becomes valuable, we'll fight over it. Times change, but sadly people remain the same. Especially the greedy elite.

Re: How the CIA Overthrew Iran's Democracy in Four Days in 1953 (2019)

#16

Post by emilsedgh »

thdrdt wrote: post #7

Most western people are very negative about countries like Iran, China and Russia because they are the 'bad guys'. Well this article again shows that there are few countries that will not gain power over dead people. It's sad but true. Now imagine you were living in Iran and came to know about the work of the CIA. Whould you think the USA is the greatest country in the world and democracy is the way to go? I think it…

Iran is still suffering heavily from that coup.

That was the closest we ever were to a democracy. However, democracy is very fragile, specially at the beginning.

And it was shattered and to this day, we never got as close. Tyrant regimes come and go and we still think what might've been. We could've easily been another France in middle east.

Source: Iranian living in the U.S.

Re: How the CIA Overthrew Iran's Democracy in Four Days in 1953 (2019)

#17

Post by lowdose »

thdrdt wrote: post #7

Most western people are very negative about countries like Iran, China and Russia because they are the 'bad guys'. Well this article again shows that there are few countries that will not gain power over dead people. It's sad but true. Now imagine you were living in Iran and came to know about the work of the CIA. Whould you think the USA is the greatest country in the world and democracy is the way to go? I think it…

I completely agree with you. I do think China is becoming more and more the example people are looking at how to make progress. Politics aside the growth in wealth and it's distribution over the last 30 years have been magic.

Most people living outside the USA are very negative about the United States because this president is a very "bad guy". I'm not under such a opinion but I find it increasingly hard to have a normal conversation about the USA and it's form of the human experiment without hitting a wall of generalised criticism that ends up in stalemate.

Considering what we know what the CIA has done in the past. What kind of shadow government is functioning without consent of the people. The media institutions that suppose to keep that power in check never really informed the public on these developments. And on top the revelation of the catholic church being the biggest pedofile network that hitted the American society probably a lot harder than Europe because of stronger religious sentiments. All things combined for me it is not strange an anti establishment campaign won the presidency.

Friends, family, people that have watched movies like the Irishman, Spotlight, the Good Shepherd are not really open to adjust their point of view on the States. Iran, China and Russia are however topics where nuanced opinion still is expressed.

Re: How the CIA Overthrew Iran's Democracy in Four Days in 1953 (2019)

#18

Post by entropyneur »

thdrdt wrote: post #7

Most western people are very negative about countries like Iran, China and Russia because they are the 'bad guys'. Well this article again shows that there are few countries that will not gain power over dead people. It's sad but true. Now imagine you were living in Iran and came to know about the work of the CIA. Whould you think the USA is the greatest country in the world and democracy is the way to go? I think it…

I'm not sure what kind mental leap would take one from "USA has terrible foreign policy" to "authoritarianism is the way to go for my country". It just doesn't seem to be plausible. The fun thing about authoritarianism though is that you don't really have to want it to end up under it.

Re: How the CIA Overthrew Iran's Democracy in Four Days in 1953 (2019)

#19

Post by GorgeIo »

missosoup wrote: post #12
thdrdt wrote: post #7

Most western people are very negative about countries like Iran, China and Russia because they are the 'bad guys'. Well this article again shows that there are few countries that will not gain power over dead people. It's sad but true. Now imagine you were living in Iran and came to know about the work of the CIA. Whould you think the USA is the greatest country in the world and democracy is the way to go? I think it…

China is harassing all of its coastal neighbours and trying to politically infiltrate just about every major country on the face of the earth. Russia is invading neighbours, actively escalating military tensions and sabre rattling. They don't really fit the same profile as Iran currently does. Feel free to walk me through the 'good guy' point of view of the people who invaded my home country, shot down a passenger pl…

"...Russia is invading neighbours, actively escalating military tensions and sabre rattling..."

Count how many times US has invaded other countries since 1949 and then come to your senses. I personally know a couple who came to my country from Ukraine because the Ukrainian fascists supported by the US were bombing their neighbourhood and killed their relatives. It was an orchestrated effort to spite Russia using Ukraine as an instrument. Who is loading the Eastern Europeran borders with Russia with arms and NATO personnel? Syria was saved by Russia as the jihadists were supported by yours trully US puppet. Please stop this nonsense. Use your brain.

Re: How the CIA Overthrew Iran's Democracy in Four Days in 1953 (2019)

#20

Post by trevyn »

thdrdt wrote: post #7

Most western people are very negative about countries like Iran, China and Russia because they are the 'bad guys'. Well this article again shows that there are few countries that will not gain power over dead people. It's sad but true. Now imagine you were living in Iran and came to know about the work of the CIA. Whould you think the USA is the greatest country in the world and democracy is the way to go? I think it…

Can we have a new site rule to not allow straw men?
Post reply on HN