Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm • Hacker News Board

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#11

Post by vorpalhex » Wed, Dec 11, 2019, 4:48 PM UTC

Jamwinner wrote: post #4

We get it citylab, you hate cars, and think everyone lives in the downtown of a metropolis. Meanwhile, the rest of us have places to be, and 99% of my country has no public transport. While I agree that city centers need more walking room, the categorical exclusion of longer distant transport options will just create more parking lots at the border of such areas. The more modern planning ignores the forest (countries…

Even in Japan, which has wonderful public transportation and was actually a joy to navigate, there are cars everywhere and frequently there are times when you need a car or your ability to get to places outside of the cities becomes expensive and takes a long time if it's possible at all.

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#12

Post by telchar » Wed, Dec 11, 2019, 4:49 PM UTC

Jamwinner wrote: post #4

We get it citylab, you hate cars, and think everyone lives in the downtown of a metropolis. Meanwhile, the rest of us have places to be, and 99% of my country has no public transport. While I agree that city centers need more walking room, the categorical exclusion of longer distant transport options will just create more parking lots at the border of such areas. The more modern planning ignores the forest (countries…

Parking lots at the border is, in my opinion, much better than parking garages in the center. At least that way the city streets won't be clogged by people coming from out of town. After they get to the city they don't need the cars, so leave them at the edge.

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#13

Post by ConceitedCode » Wed, Dec 11, 2019, 4:49 PM UTC

monknomo wrote: post #8

Jamwinner wrote: post #4

We get it citylab, you hate cars, and think everyone lives in the downtown of a metropolis. Meanwhile, the rest of us have places to be, and 99% of my country has no public transport. While I agree that city centers need more walking room, the categorical exclusion of longer distant transport options will just create more parking lots at the border of such areas. The more modern planning ignores the forest (countries…

80% of Americans live in an urban area

This is misleading to most people. The US census counts the suburbs as urban. I don't believe most people referring to urban areas are referring to people in the suburbs.

"To qualify as an urban area, the territory identified according to criteria must encompass at least 2,500 people, at least 1,500 of which reside outside institutional group quarters."

https://www.census.gov/programs-surveys/geography/about/faq/...

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#14

Post by electricviolet » Wed, Dec 11, 2019, 4:49 PM UTC

Jamwinner wrote: post #4

We get it citylab, you hate cars, and think everyone lives in the downtown of a metropolis. Meanwhile, the rest of us have places to be, and 99% of my country has no public transport. While I agree that city centers need more walking room, the categorical exclusion of longer distant transport options will just create more parking lots at the border of such areas. The more modern planning ignores the forest (countries…

Honestly I'd be fine with a model where city centers are primarily pedestrian and there are big parking garages on the borders of those areas. Less parking space would be needed overall since each residence and business wouldn't need it's own set of parking spaces that aren't always in use.

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#15

Post by everdrive » Wed, Dec 11, 2019, 4:49 PM UTC

monknomo wrote: post #8

Jamwinner wrote: post #4

We get it citylab, you hate cars, and think everyone lives in the downtown of a metropolis. Meanwhile, the rest of us have places to be, and 99% of my country has no public transport. While I agree that city centers need more walking room, the categorical exclusion of longer distant transport options will just create more parking lots at the border of such areas. The more modern planning ignores the forest (countries…

80% of Americans live in an urban area

Dense urban areas are harmed by cars, but where do you draw the line? Suppose I can drive through the suburbs of Philadelphia, but not the city center. What happens to the area around the restricted-driving zone? Does it become an crowded parking lot as people trade their cars for transit?

I'm not suggesting that there are no solution here -- I'm genuinely asking what the solutions are.

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#16

Post by benrbray » Wed, Dec 11, 2019, 4:50 PM UTC

Jamwinner wrote: post #4

We get it citylab, you hate cars, and think everyone lives in the downtown of a metropolis. Meanwhile, the rest of us have places to be, and 99% of my country has no public transport. While I agree that city centers need more walking room, the categorical exclusion of longer distant transport options will just create more parking lots at the border of such areas. The more modern planning ignores the forest (countries…

America is certainly decades (if not centuries) behind in public transportation. However, these CityLab articles are doing a great thing by highlighting our unhealthy dependence on cars and making it a part of everyday conversation. If we're ever going to change we need to start by agreeing there is a problem and discussing realistic solutions.

I don't quite understand your point about the "technological and class divide" widen[ing]. Good public transportation (as in places like Japan) drastically reduces the cost of moving around the city/country. In the United States, for most people, owning a car (an expensive up-front cost with expensive monthly payments) is a prerequisite to finding and keeping a job. Public transportation adds to our social safety net.

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#17

Post by skocznymroczny » Wed, Dec 11, 2019, 4:50 PM UTC

Jamwinner wrote: post #4

We get it citylab, you hate cars, and think everyone lives in the downtown of a metropolis. Meanwhile, the rest of us have places to be, and 99% of my country has no public transport. While I agree that city centers need more walking room, the categorical exclusion of longer distant transport options will just create more parking lots at the border of such areas. The more modern planning ignores the forest (countries…

Even having public transport doesn't mean the car is useless. Public transport fails if you have a lot of groceries to deliver, or some big products. Also public transport often takes much longer than a car, because it's stopping at every little stop, while a car can go directly, or even take a shortcut in some cases.

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#18

Post by dwnvoted2hell » Wed, Dec 11, 2019, 4:50 PM UTC

pif wrote: post #6

spats1990 wrote: post #5

The average U.S. car carries an average of 1.56 people and weighs an average, for new cars, of almost two tons.

Yes, and ... ? What's exactly your point?

The average U.S. car carries an average of 1.56 people and weighs an average, for new cars, of almost two tons.

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#19

Post by SketchySeaBeast » Wed, Dec 11, 2019, 4:50 PM UTC

NPMaxwell wrote: post #2

Part of the change is due to the appearance of alternative powered vehicles. In Tokyo, it seems like every mother is riding an electric cargo bike with covered seating for two kids and room for groceries -- the minivan of bicycles. In Seattle, the morning commute is full of electric skateboards, scooters, onewheels, and wheelchairs. It looks doable.

How do those work in winter? We had electric scooters, but they were all scooped up by their parent companies in October ahead of the coming months of hell.

Re: Car-Free Streets Will Soon Be the Norm

#20

Post by 0b0001 » Wed, Dec 11, 2019, 4:50 PM UTC

big_chungus wrote: post #10

monknomo wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

80% of Americans live in an urban area

Many of those live near and around a city, rather than in it, and commute daily.

That's one of the things that need to be solved, rather than celebrated. Commuting -- no matter which transport you're using, is a waste of time and energy.