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How to Build an Income Sharing Agreement Product

moderntreasury.com

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Re: How to Build an Income Sharing Agreement Product

#11

Post by bilbo0s »

throwaway_law wrote: post #5

It used to be society wanted people to have an education and that people with degrees would get higher paying jobs which resulted in a net benefit to society through higher taxes. Now education is just looked at as a way to in debt young people for the rest of their lives. Because 1M people default on their student loans every year and the bubble is on the verge of popping, the parasites are looking to own 10% of eve…

>The problem isn't that an API doesn't exist to automatically debit 10% from the people you own

Something's just really wrong about that statement. It saddens me. Didn't we fight a war to put an end to stuff like this?

Also, a president is not going to wave a magic wand and fix this system. If you want to support that candidate, by all means do so, it's one of the habits of healthy hearts and minds in a democracy. Just realize going in what's actually possible and what's political marketing. Fixing this is going to take a lot more work on everyone's part than simply casting a vote.

Finally, the wealthy should pay more. No argument from me on that one. Having said that, there is a game theoretical optimum on how much you should tax each person in a society. We don't want to get carried away with taxing anyone for political reasons. Liberals do that with anything that will disproportionately stick it to bankers, and conservatives have done that with anything that will disproportionately stick it to blacks. (The recent Reductio Ad Absurdum of conservatives demanding that college athletes pay taxes on scholarships is an example I'm guessing you might appreciate of how political targeting can get just a bit ridiculous.)

Re: How to Build an Income Sharing Agreement Product

#12

Post by sdan »

Only reason (as a college student) don’t like ISAs is because they take up to something as ridiculous as 10 million over a 10 year period (if you do happen to make that much). I think ISAs may find a place for a greater majority of America though.

Re: How to Build an Income Sharing Agreement Product

#13

Post by yowlingcat »

throwaway_law wrote: post #7
yowlingcat wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't disagree with you, but I'll note that the non-dischargeable terms of medical and student loan debt in the USA essentially do that already, with the added caveat of not even incentivizing the note holder to get the borrower on their feet. Is this no better than that? I think it's moving in the right direction. It's capped, and while there's still the potential structural issue of middleman taking an unfairly s…

>I don't disagree with you, but I'll note that the non-dischargeable terms of medical and student loan debt in the USA essentially do that already As a preliminary matter this is false...student loans are dischargable in bankruptcy, they are just treated differently than other debt. However, there is a reason everyone thinks student loans aren't dischargable and the myth persists... >the incentive structure of "we do…

Student loan forgiveness would be great, as would be free tuition, but do you mean on a federal level? I'd love to see such a policy come to fruition.

Re: How to Build an Income Sharing Agreement Product

#14

Post by bilbo0s »

mdorazio wrote: post #2

Is it just me or does it seem like we're now one step closer to turning people into companies with shares that can be bought and sold? It feels like a small step from ISAs for education funding to ISAs for all kinds of funding instead of traditional loan agreements and at that point you might as well sell shares of yourself to the highest bidder so they can trade your future income on a secondary market. (Note this i…

Be careful what you wish for.

Shares of this nature would be regulated as securities. Which would bring a great many uncomfortable requirements to the table.

Just as a for instance, I'll just point out that corporations have Boards of Directors and shareholder meetings. Both of which potentially determine and direct any future actions the corporation is allowed to take.

Re: How to Build an Income Sharing Agreement Product

#16

Post by JamesBarney »

throwaway_law wrote: post #5

It used to be society wanted people to have an education and that people with degrees would get higher paying jobs which resulted in a net benefit to society through higher taxes. Now education is just looked at as a way to in debt young people for the rest of their lives. Because 1M people default on their student loans every year and the bubble is on the verge of popping, the parasites are looking to own 10% of eve…

"The problem isn't that an API doesn't exist to automatically debit 10% from the people you own, the problem is an education doesn't get you a job anymore, much less a high paying job."

In classical education if you don't get a high paying job it's your problem not the university's because they've already been paid. The whole idea behind this change is to shift some of that risk of un/underemployment to the university. So if the university isn't able to get you the high paying job they promised that's their problem too(b/c they don't get paid).

Re: How to Build an Income Sharing Agreement Product

#17

Post by throwaway_law »

bilbo0s wrote: post #11
throwaway_law wrote: post #5

It used to be society wanted people to have an education and that people with degrees would get higher paying jobs which resulted in a net benefit to society through higher taxes. Now education is just looked at as a way to in debt young people for the rest of their lives. Because 1M people default on their student loans every year and the bubble is on the verge of popping, the parasites are looking to own 10% of eve…

> The problem isn't that an API doesn't exist to automatically debit 10% from the people you own Something's just really wrong about that statement. It saddens me. Didn't we fight a war to put an end to stuff like this? Also, a president is not going to wave a magic wand and fix this system. If you want to support that candidate, by all means do so, it's one of the habits of healthy hearts and minds in a democracy. J…

>Just realize going in what's actually possible and what's political marketing. Fixing this is going to take a lot more work on everyone's part than simply casting a vote.

You're not wrong, but at the same token why are Presidential candidates always speaking about things like: taxes; immigration; same sex marriage; healthcare?

The President doesn't control any of those things, doesn't have those powers...that's all the legislature.

While it may be just marketing for a candidate to say they will forgive existing students loans and provide for free education paid for by taxing the banks on what are currently tax free transactions...if that candidate wins, the 2 political parties will begin listening to voters and do what it takes to win their votes back.

Re: How to Build an Income Sharing Agreement Product

#18

Post by zajd »

throwaway_law wrote: post #5

It used to be society wanted people to have an education and that people with degrees would get higher paying jobs which resulted in a net benefit to society through higher taxes. Now education is just looked at as a way to in debt young people for the rest of their lives. Because 1M people default on their student loans every year and the bubble is on the verge of popping, the parasites are looking to own 10% of eve…

> Instead of owning peoples labor via API, why not consider the 1 Presidential candidate who is campaigning to forgive all existing student debt and make college free moving forward by god forbid...taxing the same banks the taxpayers bailed out from bankruptcy just 10 years ago.

The people who make these decisions are the ones who own the banks the taxpayers bailed out and are rewarded handsomely by the current system. Bernie would get assassinated long before he could change this sort of thing. The idea that we can just vote our way out of the current quagmire we find ourselves in is a pipe dream. The system is crafted to preserve/increase the power of the merchant class, and has been literally since the inception of the union. Modern technology/weapons/propaganda essentially ensures that there is no way to oppose the US Government and those who control it.

Re: How to Build an Income Sharing Agreement Product

#19

Post by throwaway_law »

yowlingcat wrote: post #13
throwaway_law wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I don't disagree with you, but I'll note that the non-dischargeable terms of medical and student loan debt in the USA essentially do that already As a preliminary matter this is false...student loans are dischargable in bankruptcy, they are just treated differently than other debt. However, there is a reason everyone thinks student loans aren't dischargable and the myth persists... >the incentive structure of "we do…

Student loan forgiveness would be great, as would be free tuition, but do you mean on a federal level? I'd love to see such a policy come to fruition.

I don't want to make it about politics or a politician, but you can search for their campaign platform proposal for additional details. As far as I know there is only one candidate running on this platform of student loan forgiveness, so it should come up quickly in a search.

Re: How to Build an Income Sharing Agreement Product

#20

Post by _ah »

I generally like the concept of ISAs.

The current system in the US incentivizes colleges to provide an exclusive "luxury" experience, regardless of cost. Here the incentives are more properly aligned.

In addition, ISAs place a natural cap on college cost. Where cost could previously grow without bound (all loans are backstopped by the federal government), now cost is tied directly to the prevailing wage of the graduate. To the extent that wages signal the needs of the economy at large, I'd assume that ISAs would increase the number of graduates in in-demand fields at the cost of some fringe benefits.

The big losers in this equation are the lesser-paid but still socially valuable professions such as teaching. However, it's unclear to me that these skills could not also be delivered at significantly lower cost (as they were several decades ago).

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