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H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

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Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#11

Post by sampo »

privateSFacct wrote: post #4

Ugh, these cases give H1B's a bad name. I do wish there was crackdown on crap like this. Where I work the H1B applicants (who don't get selected) have masters, from a US university, for a degree that applies specifically to their job. These folks should be on the red carpet to US citizenship. They have checked every box. Instead they get treated like crap. They should SHUT DOWN these other players who clog up the pro…

> outsourcing firms that are just numbers game body shop mills.

When there is a 6+ months wait from applying for H1-B for getting it approved or rejected, the very top candidates nor the fastest growing companies may not want to wait that long. So H1-B is by nature more appealing to companies who can play the numbers game.

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#12

Post by nerdponx »

privateSFacct wrote: post #4

Ugh, these cases give H1B's a bad name. I do wish there was crackdown on crap like this. Where I work the H1B applicants (who don't get selected) have masters, from a US university, for a degree that applies specifically to their job. These folks should be on the red carpet to US citizenship. They have checked every box. Instead they get treated like crap. They should SHUT DOWN these other players who clog up the pro…

Ugh, these cases give H1B's a bad name. I do wish there was crackdown on crap like this.

Unless I misread the article, this looks like a crackdown to me. It's a BA level QA analyst job at an outsourcing shop.

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#13

Post by jimbob45 »

It's tough to convince America that you need to import immigrants because there isn't a single American that can possibly fill the job. Some candidate (cough) is going to bring that up in the next election and I'm not sure I've seen a legitimate argument against it that isn't a generalization.

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#14

Post by wharnal »

> Sagarwala, according to the ruling in Washington, D.C. U.S. District Court, received an H-1B visa in 2012, but those visas are tied to specific employers. So when she sought to change jobs in August last year, the prospective new employer, outsourcing firm HSK Technologies, had to go through the visa application process again.

So she had lived in the US for six years and still had to beg the government for permission to change jobs? I had no idea it was this bad.

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#15

Post by ergothus »

privateSFacct wrote: post #4

Ugh, these cases give H1B's a bad name. I do wish there was crackdown on crap like this. Where I work the H1B applicants (who don't get selected) have masters, from a US university, for a degree that applies specifically to their job. These folks should be on the red carpet to US citizenship. They have checked every box. Instead they get treated like crap. They should SHUT DOWN these other players who clog up the pro…

As a baseline, I'm in favor of a lot of immigration and think people have way too many hoops to jump through in general, but the H1B crowd in particular is a group that matches even what most of those opposed to mass immigration claim to desire in immigrants.

That said, i've noticed different "worlds" of H1B worlds, with different impacts upon other workers.

I did a govt job on the US East Coast (Richmond, VA) that had a lot of H1B contract workers, likely from one of these body shops. They were good people, and adequate if unimpressive coders. They were earning decent US wages and were painfully aware that losing or leaving a job left them no guarantee there'd be another for them in the US soon. Management abused the heck out of these people, establishing practices, expectations, and treatment of coders that were terrible. They put up with it, but but it lowered the quality of the workplace for everyone, and the employees and US citizens (naturalized or born) working there also suffered, and tended to leave when they could. I was one of them, which put me in Seattle on the West Coast...

...Where I found an entirely different world of H1B workers. These were not contractors, not through a body shop, and were definitely impressive in their fields (devs, architects, and QA/Test eng, along with a handful of PMs and Team Leads). Here there was no reduction of workplace quality - these workers had lots of extra annoyances I didn't have to worry about (example: apparently changing your job title during one period of time when applying for a green card restarts the multi-year process, so I knew of people that declined or postponed promotions!) but they could definitely find work elsewhere easily enough - should workplace be unbearable they'd bounce like the rest of us could.

Whenever the H1-B debate comes up, I reflect on the different impact the workers had on these offices, and the impact the H1-B rules had on those workers. Everytime one of my friends debated if it was worth pursuing a green card or naturalization, I saw the seeming idiotic result of the US chasing away workers that it said it needed, that had proven themselves, and that american companies had spent time and money in training and getting experience to.

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#16

Post by ergothus »

wharnal wrote: post #14

> Sagarwala, according to the ruling in Washington, D.C. U.S. District Court, received an H-1B visa in 2012, but those visas are tied to specific employers. So when she sought to change jobs in August last year, the prospective new employer, outsourcing firm HSK Technologies, had to go through the visa application process again. So she had lived in the US for six years and still had to beg the government for permissi…

This is definitely, painfully, normal. It also impacts where a worker will go - big companies have immigration lawyers on staff to help with this, while smaller companies have to leave the workers to largely fight the battle on their own.

This means, regardless of wage(!), big companies have a bigger pool to hire from.

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#17

Post by nerdponx »

ergothus wrote: post #15
privateSFacct wrote: post #4

Ugh, these cases give H1B's a bad name. I do wish there was crackdown on crap like this. Where I work the H1B applicants (who don't get selected) have masters, from a US university, for a degree that applies specifically to their job. These folks should be on the red carpet to US citizenship. They have checked every box. Instead they get treated like crap. They should SHUT DOWN these other players who clog up the pro…

As a baseline, I'm in favor of a lot of immigration and think people have way too many hoops to jump through in general, but the H1B crowd in particular is a group that matches even what most of those opposed to mass immigration claim to desire in immigrants. That said, i've noticed different "worlds" of H1B worlds, with different impacts upon other workers. I did a govt job on the US East Coast (Richmond, VA) that h…

I don't even understand the point of H-1B being tied to a specific employer or job title.

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#18

Post by ineedasername »

privateSFacct wrote: post #4

Ugh, these cases give H1B's a bad name. I do wish there was crackdown on crap like this. Where I work the H1B applicants (who don't get selected) have masters, from a US university, for a degree that applies specifically to their job. These folks should be on the red carpet to US citizenship. They have checked every box. Instead they get treated like crap. They should SHUT DOWN these other players who clog up the pro…

But are there US citizens or permanent residents who are interested in the jobs your H1B's are vying for? It is a tight labor market, so it's possible there aren't many other candidates, depending on the job.

However I recently saw an opening where I work go to an H1B where there were other qualified candidates, which I don't like to see. I would rather see the H1B's have a more stable/easier path to permanent residency. Not only does it confer a longer term economic benefit to the US to have more skilled workers, it would (probably) make the worker feel more secure and stable in their life, and less beholden to stay somewhere working because their H1B status is being held over their head and preventing easy mobility.

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#19

Post by throwaway082729 »

wharnal wrote: post #14

> Sagarwala, according to the ruling in Washington, D.C. U.S. District Court, received an H-1B visa in 2012, but those visas are tied to specific employers. So when she sought to change jobs in August last year, the prospective new employer, outsourcing firm HSK Technologies, had to go through the visa application process again. So she had lived in the US for six years and still had to beg the government for permissi…

I've been here for 17+ years, earn $650k/yr and I'm still in the same boat. I'm at the mercy of the govt. if I want to change jobs. Moreover, I need to restart the labor certification process and reapply for my green card though I get to keep the same priority date. There's no end in sight i.e. I cannot predict when I'll get my green card due to the per-country cap and backlog. Worse, I cannot quit and take time off even for a day.

Re: H-1B: Federal judge backs government’s narrower view of ‘specialty occupation’

#20

Post by abc_lisper »

wharnal wrote: post #14

> Sagarwala, according to the ruling in Washington, D.C. U.S. District Court, received an H-1B visa in 2012, but those visas are tied to specific employers. So when she sought to change jobs in August last year, the prospective new employer, outsourcing firm HSK Technologies, had to go through the visa application process again. So she had lived in the US for six years and still had to beg the government for permissi…

:) I am in US for 18 years now, have a master's degree and work at a FANG company, and don't have a GC yet. I am not saying this to seek sympathy, but things are way worse than they look.

The system is gamified by outsourcing companies and body shops, that are more worried about their people in, play the numbers game and clog the H-1B and GC routes, make it difficult for everyone who is trying to do quality work without playing cheap tricks.

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