Two senators say a $5B fine isn’t enough to punish Facebook • Hacker News Board

Re: Two senators say a $5B fine isn’t enough to punish Facebook

#11

Post by commandlinefan » Tue, May 07, 2019, 6:34 PM UTC

Applejinx wrote: post #6

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #3

>While the Republicans could push through a relatively lenient offer along partisan lines, doing so could come with heavy political costs for the agency, since it would expose them to attacks that the Republican majority is soft on misbehaving technology companies. One thing that has changed recently in politics is that a significant portion of Republican base now considers Silicon Valley tech companies as foes. I wo…

>a significant portion of Republican base now considers Silicon Valley tech companies as foes Which is hilarious, as Facebook at least is happy to take Russian money to aid Republicans. Silicon Valley is party-less, stateless. They serve only money, nothing else.

> party-less

I think that’s a stretch. Mark Zuckerberg, Jeff Bezos, Jack Dorsey (Twitter), Mark Benioff (Salesforce), Tim Cook and Reed Hastings (Netflix) have all come out as rabidly pro-Democrat and have in many cases admitted to adjusting their platforms to shift public sentiment in favor of liberal politicians and liberal political causes.

Re: Two senators say a $5B fine isn’t enough to punish Facebook

#12

Post by spamizbad » Tue, May 07, 2019, 6:41 PM UTC

Maxamillion96 wrote: post #7

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #3

>While the Republicans could push through a relatively lenient offer along partisan lines, doing so could come with heavy political costs for the agency, since it would expose them to attacks that the Republican majority is soft on misbehaving technology companies. One thing that has changed recently in politics is that a significant portion of Republican base now considers Silicon Valley tech companies as foes. I wo…

If you look at conservative opinion formers, like Tucker Carlson, they're talking about breaking up major firms and so on. I think the ideology that was pro-oligarchy died on both the left and right in 2008, and only the most diehard centrists are believers in it

Some of it also has to do with the demographics of their audience. Fox news viewers skew older[1] (65, 66 for primetime) and likely are more skeptical of technology.

There's also some "working the refs" at play here, where there's conspiracy theories swirling that conservative content gets suppressed and prominent conservative voices are "shadow-banned." There's even a grassroots effort to get popular social media sites declared the "public commons" to prevent technology companies from removing content, but that's A) likely a pipedream B) Assuming it could hold up in court, would ultimately be a massive boon to the left as it would strike a decisive legal blow against the notion of "corporate personhood" and agency of private industry. A free-marketer's footgun, if you will.

[1] https://www.adweek.com/tvnewser/heres-the-median-age-of-the-...

Re: Two senators say a $5B fine isn’t enough to punish Facebook

#13

Post by Maxamillion96 » Tue, May 07, 2019, 6:52 PM UTC

spamizbad wrote: post #12

Maxamillion96 wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you look at conservative opinion formers, like Tucker Carlson, they're talking about breaking up major firms and so on. I think the ideology that was pro-oligarchy died on both the left and right in 2008, and only the most diehard centrists are believers in it

Some of it also has to do with the demographics of their audience. Fox news viewers skew older[1] (65, 66 for primetime) and likely are more skeptical of technology. There's also some "working the refs" at play here, where there's conspiracy theories swirling that conservative content gets suppressed and prominent conservative voices are "shadow-banned." There's even a grassroots effort to get popular social media si…

There’s always been conservative skepticism towards economic liberalism, like Bismarck and Theodore Roosevelt.

Re: Two senators say a $5B fine isn’t enough to punish Facebook

#14

Post by mises » Tue, May 07, 2019, 6:54 PM UTC

randyrand wrote: post #2

can governments force people to be fired? That might bring things closer to home.

The easiest way would be for the SEC to get involved. They can bar people from being officers of public companies. Of course, it would be a major abuse of power and certainly unconstitutional.

Re: Two senators say a $5B fine isn’t enough to punish Facebook

#15

Post by r00fus » Tue, May 07, 2019, 6:55 PM UTC

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #3

>While the Republicans could push through a relatively lenient offer along partisan lines, doing so could come with heavy political costs for the agency, since it would expose them to attacks that the Republican majority is soft on misbehaving technology companies. One thing that has changed recently in politics is that a significant portion of Republican base now considers Silicon Valley tech companies as foes. I wo…

Politicians only care about a) their funders and b) fear of the voters. When it comes to a choice between those two, they'll chose (a) every time.

Follow the money almost always works for politicians. There are precious few exceptions.

Re: Two senators say a $5B fine isn’t enough to punish Facebook

#16

Post by fyoving » Tue, May 07, 2019, 6:55 PM UTC

These two are former state AGs and IMHO their kind should be barred from being part of any important deliberative body, they are prosecutors with strictly punitive mindset in a legislative body that is also supposed to encourage entrepreneurship and look after national interests, and at any rate everyone should be wary of grandstanding and populist pronouncements by elected officials.

P.S

State AG should not be an elected position.

Re: Two senators say a $5B fine isn’t enough to punish Facebook

#17

Post by Implicated » Tue, May 07, 2019, 6:57 PM UTC

commandlinefan wrote: post #11

Applejinx wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>a significant portion of Republican base now considers Silicon Valley tech companies as foes Which is hilarious, as Facebook at least is happy to take Russian money to aid Republicans. Silicon Valley is party-less, stateless. They serve only money, nothing else.

> party-less I think that’s a stretch. Mark Zuckerberg, Jeff Bezos, Jack Dorsey (Twitter), Mark Benioff (Salesforce), Tim Cook and Reed Hastings (Netflix) have all come out as rabidly pro-Democrat and have in many cases admitted to adjusting their platforms to shift public sentiment in favor of liberal politicians and liberal political causes.

> and have in many cases admitted to adjusting their platforms to shift public sentiment in favor of liberal politicians and liberal political causes.

Can you cite some sources on this? I'm curious as to how these admissions came about.

Re: Two senators say a $5B fine isn’t enough to punish Facebook

#18

Post by BrainlingPdx » Tue, May 07, 2019, 7:03 PM UTC

commandlinefan wrote: post #11

Applejinx wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>a significant portion of Republican base now considers Silicon Valley tech companies as foes Which is hilarious, as Facebook at least is happy to take Russian money to aid Republicans. Silicon Valley is party-less, stateless. They serve only money, nothing else.

> party-less I think that’s a stretch. Mark Zuckerberg, Jeff Bezos, Jack Dorsey (Twitter), Mark Benioff (Salesforce), Tim Cook and Reed Hastings (Netflix) have all come out as rabidly pro-Democrat and have in many cases admitted to adjusting their platforms to shift public sentiment in favor of liberal politicians and liberal political causes.

[flagged]

Re: Two senators say a $5B fine isn’t enough to punish Facebook

#19

Post by spamizbad » Tue, May 07, 2019, 7:09 PM UTC

Maxamillion96 wrote: post #13

spamizbad wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of it also has to do with the demographics of their audience. Fox news viewers skew older[1] (65, 66 for primetime) and likely are more skeptical of technology. There's also some "working the refs" at play here, where there's conspiracy theories swirling that conservative content gets suppressed and prominent conservative voices are "shadow-banned." There's even a grassroots effort to get popular social media si…

There’s always been conservative skepticism towards economic liberalism, like Bismarck and Theodore Roosevelt.

Historically, that's certainly true. But I'm not sure if modern conservatism has fully acknowledged their own ideological conflicts with free markets. It's all anecdotal, but talking to conservatives about these issues they often will say technology companies are cheating, employing anti-competitive practices, or even breaking the law and that such restrictions aren't changing market dynamics but simply punishing a few bad actors.

Re: Two senators say a $5B fine isn’t enough to punish Facebook

#20

Post by gist » Tue, May 07, 2019, 7:11 PM UTC

fyoving wrote: post #16

These two are former state AGs and IMHO their kind should be barred from being part of any important deliberative body, they are prosecutors with strictly punitive mindset in a legislative body that is also supposed to encourage entrepreneurship and look after national interests, and at any rate everyone should be wary of grandstanding and populist pronouncements by elected officials. P.S State AG should not be an el…

> their kind should be barred from being part of any important deliberative body

It is hard for me to not agree with that (at least emotionally) but I would then argue further to also limit the number of attorneys that are legislatures since as a very general rule they are trained to think a certain way. Of course this idea (your idea and my idea) is not practical and will never happen. But the truth is like with any profession if you are in it long enough you tend to think in a certain way.

I remember Obama (a trained Harvard Lawyer) thinking he could just sit down the two parties in the middle east conflict and just have them talk things out. Like it was going to be some kind of binding arbitration where both sides were reasonable and not impacted by past biases (or other influences). A totally ridiculous idea. (Not saying by the way that had anything to do with the fact that he was trained as an attorney but more that to your point a person's past can determine greatly how they think things should be handled).

Prosecutors are reinforced by winning even in the face of evidence of innocence to the contrary just like sports teams win that is the name of the game not being nice to your opponents.