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Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

theintercept.com

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Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#11

Post by dalbasal »

So... I'm a worried netizen. I have concerns about data monopolies, privacy, surveillance, the ad-tech industry, cambridge analyticas... which puts me in the hn majority, I guess.

That said, what specifically are we aiming for. Privacy laws? Is there a bullet point of what these laws prohibit/require? Enforcement mechanisms? Standards? Protocols?

"Pro-privacy" isn't really enough, for a political program.

It would be great if one of these think tanks could put forward a specific agenda, preferably one that a large portion of us can support. What is it we want achieved?

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#13

Post by duxup »

kurthr wrote: post #4
duxup wrote: post #3

At this point the statement and other gestures that a company "value's your privacy" is just a default poster someone puts up, while they do other things.

We value your privacy at $0.0003 per click!

I'm working on a side project and the setup is basically that you get to see all the data I have on you. Granted this is a tiny project that is largely just for me, but as a policy that seems like that is the most clear cut way to go.

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#14

Post by luckylion »

heavenlyblue wrote: post #9
4ntonius8lock wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any law/legal mechanism which could put automatic expiration on new laws? Is there anything I could suggest to my lawmakers for this to happen? I mean, we seem to be following a pattern: Big power wants something that directly and negatively impact the quality of life of the majority of the populace. Populace rises up against this. Big power 'loses'. Big power makes the push again next year. People rise up,…

Democratically speaking, the only reason Big Power wins is due to the fact that it's incredibly inefficient to stand behind interests of many parties investing small amounts against single players investing huge amounts. One would think we need interest groups more.

> One would think we need interest groups more.

Would love to see more of those, especially in the EU, and the way they have them in the US. I'd love a privacy focused action group, but I don't want to buy a host of unrelated political issues with that. The EFF and similar organisations do a pretty good job at that, would love if we had more groups like that over here.

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#15

Post by raxxorrax »

dalbasal wrote: post #11

So... I'm a worried netizen. I have concerns about data monopolies, privacy, surveillance, the ad-tech industry, cambridge analyticas... which puts me in the hn majority, I guess. That said, what specifically are we aiming for. Privacy laws? Is there a bullet point of what these laws prohibit/require? Enforcement mechanisms? Standards? Protocols? "Pro-privacy" isn't really enough, for a political program. It would be…

I think the best approach to informational self-determination is to define that any information concerning you as a person belongs to yourself. Any diversion needs active consent. This is what this think tank (a name for every sweaty office) allegedly wants to get rid off.

I doubt this clear definition is impractical or utopian and could very well be implemented, so I doubt effective privacy legislation needs to be extensive. People consent to share information all the time. That would of course cost an industry that has stakes in information about you, even if that is not their primary business.

Furthermore it is worth to think about if there is any information about you which you are not eligible to share.

It is not trivial to determine if information is personal. Perhaps there should be a formal process to determine that.

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#16

Post by ocdtrekkie »

dalbasal wrote: post #11

So... I'm a worried netizen. I have concerns about data monopolies, privacy, surveillance, the ad-tech industry, cambridge analyticas... which puts me in the hn majority, I guess. That said, what specifically are we aiming for. Privacy laws? Is there a bullet point of what these laws prohibit/require? Enforcement mechanisms? Standards? Protocols? "Pro-privacy" isn't really enough, for a political program. It would be…

Fundamentally, I think we need two key concepts:

- US equivalent of GDPR: A law that would guarantee us the right to control data about us, be informed of data collected on us, and request a copy or delete that data. The critical impact here is to protect our privacy with regards to corporations.

- A generally-defined right to privacy: The EU enshrines privacy as a fundamental human right, the US equivalent would be for us to define a general right to privacy as an amendment to the Constitution. Much like the original Bill of Rights, I would like a right to privacy which is more solidified than the implied one built on other existing rights, but open to interpretation enough to allow for it to adapt to changing situations in the future. The core concept here is to protect our privacy with regards to the government.

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#17

Post by JohnFen »

4ntonius8lock wrote: post #7
ignoramous wrote: post #5

The fact that a 100% of the think-tanks taking corporate funding (from the likes of Microsoft, Amazon, Twitter, Facebook, Google, Airbnb, Uber, Verizon, eBay) are trying to undermine excellent privacy laws passed by California [0] and Illinois state assemblies should come as a surprise to no one. The problem is these think-tanks or variants thereof might end up representing the tech industry in most places where it m…

Is there any law/legal mechanism which could put automatic expiration on new laws? Is there anything I could suggest to my lawmakers for this to happen? I mean, we seem to be following a pattern: Big power wants something that directly and negatively impact the quality of life of the majority of the populace. Populace rises up against this. Big power 'loses'. Big power makes the push again next year. People rise up,…

> Is there any law/legal mechanism which could put automatic expiration on new laws?

It can be (and has been for some laws) done. In the past, it's been done by including "sunset provisions" in the law itself, where the law must be periodically confirmed by a new vote or it automatically ceases to have force of law.

It would also be legally possible to create a law that places sunset provisions on all subsequent laws. I have been in favor of this approach for a very long time. Practically, it's not going to happen, though.

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#18

Post by JohnFen »

duxup wrote: post #13
kurthr wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We value your privacy at $0.0003 per click!

I'm working on a side project and the setup is basically that you get to see all the data I have on you. Granted this is a tiny project that is largely just for me, but as a policy that seems like that is the most clear cut way to go.

But could I both delete the data you have and tell you not to collect more?

Transparency is great, but all by itself it means little.

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#19

Post by soared »

raxxorrax wrote: post #15
dalbasal wrote: post #11

So... I'm a worried netizen. I have concerns about data monopolies, privacy, surveillance, the ad-tech industry, cambridge analyticas... which puts me in the hn majority, I guess. That said, what specifically are we aiming for. Privacy laws? Is there a bullet point of what these laws prohibit/require? Enforcement mechanisms? Standards? Protocols? "Pro-privacy" isn't really enough, for a political program. It would be…

I think the best approach to informational self-determination is to define that any information concerning you as a person belongs to yourself. Any diversion needs active consent. This is what this think tank (a name for every sweaty office) allegedly wants to get rid off. I doubt this clear definition is impractical or utopian and could very well be implemented, so I doubt effective privacy legislation needs to be e…

> any information concerning you as a person belongs to yourself. Any diversion needs active consent

But in the US that isn't true even outside of the internet. If you walk outside of your home/land, I can legally photograph and record video of you. I can write down what you're wearing, make assumptions about your income based on your address, record you gender/age/etc. All of that is 100% legal - you willingly give up information about yourself when you go to public places.

You could argue the internet is not a public space but that counters most pro-privacy people's opinions on free speech/etc online.

Re: Tech Industry-Funded Think Tanks Work to Overturn California Privacy Law

#20

Post by soared »

duxup wrote: post #13
kurthr wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We value your privacy at $0.0003 per click!

I'm working on a side project and the setup is basically that you get to see all the data I have on you. Granted this is a tiny project that is largely just for me, but as a policy that seems like that is the most clear cut way to go.

The big data players have tools for this. For example:

https://datacloudoptout.oracle.com/registry/

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