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Tech Salaries Stagnant Despite Low Unemployment: Survey

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Re: Tech Salaries Stagnant Despite Low Unemployment: Survey

#11

Post by codemac »

kamarg wrote: post #8
jgalt212 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't buy it. FAANG pays X, so other companies know they need to pay 1.3X to hire FAANG level engineers. So the info sharing may help FAANG collude, but it won't suppress wages for those who can be poached from FAANG. That's assuming there aren't any behind the scenes no-poaching agreements. https://www.cnet.com/news/apple-google-others-settle-anti-po...

Are there many companies that can pay 1.3x of FAANG compensation? One of the big reasons people go work at the big 5 is the pay.

Just SV unicorns usually, and even then a lot of it is speculated value.

But the unicorns definitely pay if you're above a certain experience level - and if you build the correct professional network you can basically demand it.

Re: Tech Salaries Stagnant Despite Low Unemployment: Survey

#12

Post by dilyevsky »

kamarg wrote: post #8
jgalt212 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't buy it. FAANG pays X, so other companies know they need to pay 1.3X to hire FAANG level engineers. So the info sharing may help FAANG collude, but it won't suppress wages for those who can be poached from FAANG. That's assuming there aren't any behind the scenes no-poaching agreements. https://www.cnet.com/news/apple-google-others-settle-anti-po...

Are there many companies that can pay 1.3x of FAANG compensation? One of the big reasons people go work at the big 5 is the pay.

Google is famous for lowballing and downlevelling so at least in G case it’s not always the case.

Re: Tech Salaries Stagnant Despite Low Unemployment: Survey

#13

Post by Apocryphon »

_bxg1 wrote: post #10

I'd bet it's just a function of what people are willing to do the job for. $93k gives you a very comfortable lifestyle, and tech workers tend to be much more motivated by the work itself than their peers. Those who really care about getting rich will go to SV and do a startup. So there's not as much pressure for increase.

SV/SF CoL is still horribly high, NYC/DC and SEA probably little better.

Re: Tech Salaries Stagnant Despite Low Unemployment: Survey

#14

Post by kamarg »

_bxg1 wrote: post #10

I'd bet it's just a function of what people are willing to do the job for. $93k gives you a very comfortable lifestyle, and tech workers tend to be much more motivated by the work itself than their peers. Those who really care about getting rich will go to SV and do a startup. So there's not as much pressure for increase.

Er...isn't the general agreement that if you want to get rich you absolutely should not go work for or found a startup but instead get a steady job at big corp and live below your means? People are always on about how shares in a startup should be counted as $0 compensation. Not to mention $93k doesn't go very far in places with large populations and high job prospects.

Re: Tech Salaries Stagnant Despite Low Unemployment: Survey

#15

Post by idiot900 »

_bxg1 wrote: post #10

I'd bet it's just a function of what people are willing to do the job for. $93k gives you a very comfortable lifestyle, and tech workers tend to be much more motivated by the work itself than their peers. Those who really care about getting rich will go to SV and do a startup. So there's not as much pressure for increase.

$93k does not give a very comfortable lifestyle in SF/NYC.

Re: Tech Salaries Stagnant Despite Low Unemployment: Survey

#16

Post by toomuchtodo »

_bxg1 wrote: post #10

I'd bet it's just a function of what people are willing to do the job for. $93k gives you a very comfortable lifestyle, and tech workers tend to be much more motivated by the work itself than their peers. Those who really care about getting rich will go to SV and do a startup. So there's not as much pressure for increase.

$93k supporting a family (stay at home partner, two kids) is most definitely not comfortable, whether in the Midwest or the coasts. Insurance premiums alone would be ~$15k/year (pretax, but still). Throw in a mortgage or rent @ $1500/month, that's another $18k/year, you've already consumed a third of your wages.

Re: Tech Salaries Stagnant Despite Low Unemployment: Survey

#17

Post by trhway »

jgalt212 wrote: post #4
iaw wrote: post #2

A trend I've seen is using salary consultation services that peg the company compensation to rest of market. When enough of an industry does this it has the same result as price fixing but without collusion.

I don't buy it. FAANG pays X, so other companies know they need to pay 1.3X to hire FAANG level engineers. So the info sharing may help FAANG collude, but it won't suppress wages for those who can be poached from FAANG. That's assuming there aren't any behind the scenes no-poaching agreements. https://www.cnet.com/news/apple-google-others-settle-anti-po...

>I don't buy it. FAANG pays X, so other companies know they need to pay 1.3X to hire FAANG level engineers.

no. The rest knows that they can pay 0.3-0.5X to hire the rest of the engineers. C people hire C people and there are always more than enough C people around. Our BigCo has no talent shortage for example(we'll even be cutting 5-10% in the next few months - just fat trimming, the company has no financial issues forcing to do it), and i have hard time imagining what would a FAANG level engineer would be doing around here - try to imagine a Stanford CS MS grad with the thesis in deep learning helping a huge enterprise customer through 6 stages of grief during the escalation call :)

The overall stagnation is only overall. Inside the tech salaries distribution there is a structural change of it becoming strongly bi-modal. So there is very high competition for talent and very high salaries (Google L5/6/7 medians being like 550/650/750 with the rest of FAANG being similar) at the high segment, and the rest just happily chugging along with 2% yearly CPI increase at best which actually means slowly sliding downhill instead of mere stagnation.

Re: Tech Salaries Stagnant Despite Low Unemployment: Survey

#18

Post by pkaye »

idiot900 wrote: post #15
_bxg1 wrote: post #10

I'd bet it's just a function of what people are willing to do the job for. $93k gives you a very comfortable lifestyle, and tech workers tend to be much more motivated by the work itself than their peers. Those who really care about getting rich will go to SV and do a startup. So there's not as much pressure for increase.

$93k does not give a very comfortable lifestyle in SF/NYC.

You certainly can is you bought your house 10+ years ago.

Re: Tech Salaries Stagnant Despite Low Unemployment: Survey

#19

Post by SquirrelOnFire »

conanbatt wrote: post #9
iaw wrote: post #2

A trend I've seen is using salary consultation services that peg the company compensation to rest of market. When enough of an industry does this it has the same result as price fixing but without collusion.

Thats not how it works. You cant put prices unilaterally in a market: a single company offering more would capture all talent.

That's not how it works. Educated, creative workers look for more than just salary. Increases in autonomy, purpose, and opportunity for mastery are often viewed as more valuable than money (once threshold levels of income have been crossed)[1]

[1] Drive by Daniel Pink

Re: Tech Salaries Stagnant Despite Low Unemployment: Survey

#20

Post by jriot »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #16
_bxg1 wrote: post #10

I'd bet it's just a function of what people are willing to do the job for. $93k gives you a very comfortable lifestyle, and tech workers tend to be much more motivated by the work itself than their peers. Those who really care about getting rich will go to SV and do a startup. So there's not as much pressure for increase.

$93k supporting a family (stay at home partner, two kids) is most definitely not comfortable, whether in the Midwest or the coasts. Insurance premiums alone would be ~$15k/year (pretax, but still). Throw in a mortgage or rent @ $1500/month, that's another $18k/year, you've already consumed a third of your wages.

Im at a $100k, my wife stays at home with our two school age kids, we live quite comfortably.
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