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Ryanair, Hamiltonian Cycles, and using graph theory to find cheap flights

blog.jonlu.ca

11–20 of 135 posts

Re: Ryanair, Hamiltonian Cycles, and using graph theory to find cheap flights

#11
post #4

Off-topic but related: https://scottscheapflights.com is _amazing_. The Premium sub is worth every penny...my wife and I will be doing a ton more overseas travel in 2019 purely because of the deals this site finds.

Also off-topic, I would pay a premium for the deals to be pre-searched for my specific cities/dates. I already pay for scotts premium. But would pay even more if I was able to actually have it look at my calendar and see when I could go on these trips. I miss out on too many due to not being quick enough.

I've had the same issue and have been building a tool to further filter and curate flight deals. Right now you can select departure airports and airlines. Date filtering will be coming next in the next 5-7 days if not sooner. https://producthunt.com/posts/altitude

Re: Ryanair, Hamiltonian Cycles, and using graph theory to find cheap flights

#12
back when I was a student, I would sometimes spend hours on Ryanair's website to find that type of deals.

My base was Paris and I wanted to go to Stockholm for example. The direct Ryanair flight from Paris to Stockholm was expensive (Let's say 150 euros). I would manage to find two cheap flights that go for example from Paris to Rome and another one from Rome to Stockholm, both of those for 10 Euros each. The key is to use the big Ryanair hubs as gateway (Milan and Brussels would work really well back in the days)

I would basically lose my whole day traveling to save 80 euros. Sometimes it backfires though, and when it backfires you are on your own. Once my first flight got super delayed, and I got stuck in Milan for the night. I managed to have Ryanair rebook my second flight for the day.

I think Ryanair wants to be able to propose high prices for direct flights and prevent people from finding those cheaper indirect flights. That's why they don't make it easy to find them.

Re: Ryanair, Hamiltonian Cycles, and using graph theory to find cheap flights

#13
post #5

Great work, this is really cool! For multi city flights, I've found Google flights does things really well from a UX standpoint, and I believe they support Ryanair.

They do support Ryanair, I’ve found great deals through it. Lots of other discount Euro airlines are unsupported though

I'm surprised Ryanair is supported, given that they've been engaged in a long and nasty lawsuit with Expedia, over scraping their fares. I was under the impression Ryanair only wanted to sell fares through their own website.

Re: Ryanair, Hamiltonian Cycles, and using graph theory to find cheap flights

#14
Looks cool! The problem of enumerating the best routes between two given airports is indeed an interesting problem. My favorite discussion of the problem is from Carl de Marcken: http://www.ai.mit.edu/courses/6.034f/psets/ps1/airtravel.pdf

I've been involved in solving a similar problem, on the award flight search side. There are about 12,000 direct commercial routes offering award redemption, and the airline websites have different limitations: some only let you search one-way or only round-trip, or only one cabin at a time, or only give hints about available quantities. So you have to formulate the minimal set of queries that will give you complete information. And then given an origin and destination, figure out the valid routings, like you've discovered.

The other really interesting challenge with many of the airline websites are the extreme measures they go to, to block you from crawling their data. My favorite is British Airways, which runs 800 different tests to fingerprint your browser, from generating audio files to drawing to an off-screen canvas, all inside a custom VM with encrypted byte code. (Similar to how I've seen Google obfuscate the ReCaptcha code base.) Surprising to hear that Ryanair makes it so easy to access prices in comparison!

Re: Ryanair, Hamiltonian Cycles, and using graph theory to find cheap flights

#15
Hacking PNR https://media.ccc.de/v/33c3-7964-where_in_the_world_is_carme... at time of the talk (2 years ago) used/discussed these sites:

https://matrix.itasoftware.com/ to get detailed fare rules & restrictions

https://www.expertflyer.com & https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/seat-alerts/id533533342

https://www.checkmytrip.com/ allows entering name & booking-reference and gives all detail

https://www.viewtrip.com/

https://tripcase.com will use name + booking-reference to get detailed PNR information including the first name

https://www.fly.kiev.ua can make a flight reservation without a payment, still gives an 6char booking-reference

Re: Ryanair, Hamiltonian Cycles, and using graph theory to find cheap flights

#16
Somewhat off-topic and shameless plug, I'm working on a meta flight-search engine that finds the cheapest flights from multiple origins to the same destination (i.e. me and some friends who live in another city want to fly to Hong Kong with no particular date in mind, just want the cheapest flights and with overlapping departure/return dates). Does anyone else have a similar need or know of anything that can do this?

Re: Ryanair, Hamiltonian Cycles, and using graph theory to find cheap flights

#17
post #14

Looks cool! The problem of enumerating the best routes between two given airports is indeed an interesting problem. My favorite discussion of the problem is from Carl de Marcken: http://www.ai.mit.edu/courses/6.034f/psets/ps1/airtravel.pdf I've been involved in solving a similar problem, on the award flight search side. There are about 12,000 direct commercial routes offering award redemption, and the airline website…

Many moons ago, I worked in the travel industry. Most airlines aren't running their own technology stack -- they are paying someone else $/search to drive their webpage. In a market of razor thin margins, paying per search for you to crawl their flight catalog is a big problem -- thus the arms race. The only way to win at this is to own the catalog, this is why Google bought ITA.

Ryanair is the kind of airline that I would suspect might run their own stack, and therefore not have the same cost structure.

Re: Ryanair, Hamiltonian Cycles, and using graph theory to find cheap flights

#18

back when I was a student, I would sometimes spend hours on Ryanair's website to find that type of deals. My base was Paris and I wanted to go to Stockholm for example. The direct Ryanair flight from Paris to Stockholm was expensive (Let's say 150 euros). I would manage to find two cheap flights that go for example from Paris to Rome and another one from Rome to Stockholm, both of those for 10 Euros each. The key is…

Most comparison sites will show you these routes, for example Kiwi lets me search indirect flights from where I am in a remote part of Spain to where I live the other side of Europe. There's no direct routes, but it gives me the option of connecting in Barcelona, Stansted or Hahn, or cheaper options if I want more that one stop. It also lets me search a whole month to find the cheapest flights in a given time period, and will provide options with different low-cost airlines if that's cheaper.

However if you book direct through these sites you are going to get the lowest ticketing class. With Ryanair that means you can't take anything more than a small bag onboard (since November you need to pay for a 10kg cabin bag, you can't drop it at the gate for free), and if you are in a group you will not be sitting next to each other, so it may be best to book directly through the airline's site.

The simple reason why Ryanair don't let you book multi-leg flights directly is because they don't want to be responsible for you missing a connection. It's ironic though, as compared to national European airlines I find their punctuality a lot better.

Re: Ryanair, Hamiltonian Cycles, and using graph theory to find cheap flights

#19
We (me and friend) are working on the same problem, however we are stuck at the next step. Namely the user interface: how do you let the user search through all the possibilities.

We created some data structures that allow almost instant searching of such routes and we have scrapers running regularly on Ryanair, easyJet, wizzair, and Transavia. You can query the algorithm here: https://algo.tripchemy.com/routes/TSF?year=2019&month=02&day...

Where you want to have a trip of 20 days (4 lovatons, 5 flights) from 10 Feb. Starting and returning to TSF. We also added some scoring for niceness of airports.

Re: Ryanair, Hamiltonian Cycles, and using graph theory to find cheap flights

#20

Great work, this is really cool! For multi city flights, I've found Google flights does things really well from a UX standpoint, and I believe they support Ryanair.

Google Flights is generally fine. But sometimes it figures out quite fringe stuff like Stockholm-Dublin roundtrip with a 17 hour layover in Dubai. It was not cheap either. Sounded like something like a global minima.
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