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What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

freemovement.org.uk

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Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#11

Post by bograt »

personjerry wrote: post #3

I don’t think the government did anything wrong; The rules aren’t meant to be bent, and if Lucas made a mistake in filing the wrong paperwork, it absolutely makes sense for the consequences to follow. In these serious legal matters, you need to seek counsel. This article attempts to paint a picture of the poor child, but the law was clear, and any emotional appeal should be invalid.

> I don’t think the government did anything wrong.

I think that rather depends on whether you regard the role of government here to assist its (future) citizens, or censure them (narrowly avoiding arrest and detention in this case) for what appear to be minor violations of immigration law.

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#12

Post by heavenlyblue »

personjerry wrote: post #3

I don’t think the government did anything wrong; The rules aren’t meant to be bent, and if Lucas made a mistake in filing the wrong paperwork, it absolutely makes sense for the consequences to follow. In these serious legal matters, you need to seek counsel. This article attempts to paint a picture of the poor child, but the law was clear, and any emotional appeal should be invalid.

Try calling the Home Office support line and ask them a simple question: "If I had been a student for the past 5 years and had fully supported myself by working for the same period of time, do I need to present you with the health insurance papers that are required if you are a student?".

I'm betting that for every 5 calls you make over there, you'll get a different answer. That is also true for the applications made, which sometimes require re-submission in such edge cases (with obviously an incredibly short notice period).

I am not appealing to any sentiment over here, but frankly it's a system that is inherently hostile even towards those who try hard to make sure the application is done right.

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#13

Post by avar »

blattimwind wrote: post #9

"Indefinite leave to remain" sounds like some almost Orwellian concoction of meaninglessness to me. How exactly do you get from "permission to stay in the country" (aha, it means one has the permission to stay in the country) to "indefinite leave to remain" (uhm... to remain here, I need to leave indefinitely?)

This is just what the UK calls permanent residency: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permanent_residency

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#14

Post by pavlov »

Anti-immigration people in various countries often argue that they just want to prevent “bad ones” coming in, they’re not looking to throw out the “good ones”.

The reality is that there’s no leniency for perceived good immigrants as these people imagine, and it’s just getting worse as immigration policies are tightened across Europe. Officials are under pressure to refuse as many applications as they can, and it’s easiest in cases like this where you can hide behind a legality. The “good ones” are the first to suffer.

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#15

Post by jarym »

There are two* UK government departments that are full of incompetent decision makers and absolutely no culture of common sense or doing the right thing:

1. The Home Office

2. HMRC (aka Her Majesty’s arseholes)

This doesn’t surprise me. I honestly am begining to think that change will only come once senior civil servants meet a dose of mob justice. The public’s tolerance is at breaking point imo.

*at minimum

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#16

Post by ksdale »

blattimwind wrote: post #9

"Indefinite leave to remain" sounds like some almost Orwellian concoction of meaninglessness to me. How exactly do you get from "permission to stay in the country" (aha, it means one has the permission to stay in the country) to "indefinite leave to remain" (uhm... to remain here, I need to leave indefinitely?)

"Leave" in this instance means "permission" rather than "exit"

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#18

Post by zaroth »

personjerry wrote: post #3

I don’t think the government did anything wrong; The rules aren’t meant to be bent, and if Lucas made a mistake in filing the wrong paperwork, it absolutely makes sense for the consequences to follow. In these serious legal matters, you need to seek counsel. This article attempts to paint a picture of the poor child, but the law was clear, and any emotional appeal should be invalid.

Thankfully while the beaurocracy might like it better dishing out cold refusals based on a misfiled form, the law doesn’t work that way. You don’t actually get to throw away someone’s station in life because of a paperwork mistake. And we see once a judge was involved in fact the law made the right call.

Of course Lucas fucked up by filling out the wrong form and should have had a lawyer review it. And his immigration status was at stake and he blew it. It doesn’t mean these things can’t be fixed by humans making the right decision.

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#19

Post by foxhill »

personjerry wrote: post #3

I don’t think the government did anything wrong; The rules aren’t meant to be bent, and if Lucas made a mistake in filing the wrong paperwork, it absolutely makes sense for the consequences to follow. In these serious legal matters, you need to seek counsel. This article attempts to paint a picture of the poor child, but the law was clear, and any emotional appeal should be invalid.

so, to confirm, you believe that destitution, embarrassment, shame, depression, and eventual arrest - not to mention having to come to terms with being forced into a place you have never lived before - are reasonable consequences of being slightly cavalier about paperwork? if so, 8 months to respond to an application should elicit a much harsher punishment.

edit: to all that are down voting this comment, please don’t. this is our opportunity to explain why we feel this is a bad view to have, and “silencing” this person’s opinion, if anything, can only have the effect of reenforcing this belief.

this is not a spam comment, this is discussion.

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#20

Post by nutjob2 »

This is par for the course in the UK right now. The Tories have been pandering to the xenophobes and racists for some time now an their "hostile environment" for immigrants isn't restricted to ones who are doing something illegal, instead it seems to be targeted toward making life miserable, if not impossible for any immigrants wether they're doing the right thing or not. They have no problems breaking their own rules and aggressively using the courts (appealing cases and then withdrawing their claims the day before the hearing, for instance).

In the case of the Windrush Generation, who just happen to be black, the Home Office destroyed archives that contained proof of eligibility of residence, against their own rules, that caused people to become destitute and/or deported when the government wrongly took away their rights:

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-43782241

This poor guy should be thankful that the government didn't deem him a terrorist and ruin his life completely:

https://qz.com/1275866/the-british-government-is-using-simpl...

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