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What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

money.cnn.com

11–20 of 46 posts

Re: What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

#11
I've read reports that the global bee population is not actually decreacing. The poplution seem to be decreasing in the USA and a few other areas in Great Britaitn and Holand, but overall there's no evidence of the world population being signifficantly lowered.

This is the only source I could find with a quick search, and it's in spanish [PDF]http://www.fcen.uba.ar/prensa/cable/2010/pdf/Cable_752.pdf

Re: What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

#12

If any of those reading this are in the business of writing news articles, then, please: If you want to tell me about a scientist's report being something fake he cooked up (for fame or because someone paid him to say it or whatever), then first tell me what, scientifically, is or might be wrong with the report, and then tell me about his background and financial incentives and stuff. I believe it's supposed to be go…

The gist of this article was not that the original report was "something fake" the scientist "cooked up". It was that the scientist received funding from an interested party that he failed to disclose.

While it is true that in the realm of pure logical discourse this fact is irrelevant to the argumentative structure of the original paper, in the real world it is a significant fact that legitimately questions the credibility of the scientist.

Re: What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

#13
Guess what. If they are able to fix the bee genocide with some sort of pharmaceutical... that means that it was the virus/bacteria/fungus that caused the problem! This New York Times article isn't bringing the bees back.

I don't think Bayer thought it would be great to make people think this would work, for PR (?) and then to go ahead and NOT be able to fix it. We're not talking about 9/11 or something that you can sort of say "we're stopping another one of those from happening every day."

Instead, we have ONGOING deaths that we don't know the cause of. So if this particular study, and any extrapolated treatment ACTUALLY WORKS. Then yes, it wasn't pesticides. Maybe Bayer is wrong, but the article is pretty clear this is preliminary.

Re: What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

#14

If any of those reading this are in the business of writing news articles, then, please: If you want to tell me about a scientist's report being something fake he cooked up (for fame or because someone paid him to say it or whatever), then first tell me what, scientifically, is or might be wrong with the report, and then tell me about his background and financial incentives and stuff. I believe it's supposed to be go…

In general people love to hear (essentially gossip) about other people much more than scientific stuff.

Re: What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

#15

If any of those reading this are in the business of writing news articles, then, please: If you want to tell me about a scientist's report being something fake he cooked up (for fame or because someone paid him to say it or whatever), then first tell me what, scientifically, is or might be wrong with the report, and then tell me about his background and financial incentives and stuff. I believe it's supposed to be go…

The gist of this article was not that the original report was "something fake" the scientist "cooked up". It was that the scientist received funding from an interested party that he failed to disclose. While it is true that in the realm of pure logical discourse this fact is irrelevant to the argumentative structure of the original paper, in the real world it is a significant fact that legitimately questions the cred…

Except of course when the scientist is paid by a government agency and concludes that the government needs more power - then the funding or employment situation is irrelevant.

Re: What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

#16

If any of those reading this are in the business of writing news articles, then, please: If you want to tell me about a scientist's report being something fake he cooked up (for fame or because someone paid him to say it or whatever), then first tell me what, scientifically, is or might be wrong with the report, and then tell me about his background and financial incentives and stuff. I believe it's supposed to be go…

> I believe it's supposed to be good news-article-writing style to put the most important facts and overview first.

The way I read the article, the most important fact was that he was paid by Bayer.

Re: What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

#17
post #16

If any of those reading this are in the business of writing news articles, then, please: If you want to tell me about a scientist's report being something fake he cooked up (for fame or because someone paid him to say it or whatever), then first tell me what, scientifically, is or might be wrong with the report, and then tell me about his background and financial incentives and stuff. I believe it's supposed to be go…

> I believe it's supposed to be good news-article-writing style to put the most important facts and overview first. The way I read the article, the most important fact was that he was paid by Bayer.

I'm not surprised in the least. Bayer has a huge cropscience division, and bees are integral to them selling crops and seed.

Seems more like an oversight than "nefarious pan-government cum dystopian corporate plot".

Re: What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

#19
Oh, whatever.

a) He didn't use the funding for this study.

b) Science papers aren't opinion articles. Nowhere in the study did he say that the virus and the fungus are exclusively the cause of the epidemic. If you got that impression, that was the media editorializing the study. If he falsified or omitted data, then he's guilty. But all he did was show that these two pathogens are present in collapsed colonies. You can't criticize the guy for something that another writer invented.

Re: What a scientist didn't tell the New York Times about his study on bee deaths

#20
This touches on an very important topic: the corruption of scientists (often "scientists") by funding. The corruption that lead to the "climate consensus" is now costing the world a LOT, and the green-industrial complex is not likely to rest on its laurels.
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