It is time for Universal Basic Income.
Millions of educated, experienced workers are tossed aside by a strong economy
11–20 of 125 posts
Re: Millions of educated, experienced workers are tossed aside by a strong economy
#12Earlier quoted context omitted.
You know, I keep hearing the 'many stopped working during the recession' thing bandied about like received wisdom, and have not seen any statistics to back that up. Note: I am not saying it's not true, just that I personally haven't seen any studies or reports to back up that fact. Have you a link? All the U6 (real) unemployment rate numbers I've seen indicate 'real' unemployment is back to pre-recession numbers
https://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS11300000 There's this. This doesn't exactly back up the claim - there are a lot of reasons people might not be participating.
Especially this: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LNU01300060
25-54 year Labor Paticipation Rate is those that you'd expect to be working but aren't.
Re: Millions of educated, experienced workers are tossed aside by a strong economy
#13Earlier quoted context omitted.
You know, I keep hearing the 'many stopped working during the recession' thing bandied about like received wisdom, and have not seen any statistics to back that up. Note: I am not saying it's not true, just that I personally haven't seen any studies or reports to back up that fact. Have you a link? All the U6 (real) unemployment rate numbers I've seen indicate 'real' unemployment is back to pre-recession numbers
How do you propose such statistics be collected if these people have given up and are no longer looking for a job and are no longer receiving unemployment benefits? I assume this is why the unemployment rate doesn't include these people and therefore doesn't ever reflect reality.
I see.
So you just feel like there are millions of such people, and don't have any actual facts to back that statement up.
And there is a statistic that does capture those kind of discouraged workers, it's the U6 unemployment rate. https://www.investopedia.com/articles/investing/080415/true-... And like I said, the U6 numbers do not reflect your original statement that millions of people gave up during the recession and have not worked since.
Re: Millions of educated, experienced workers are tossed aside by a strong economy
#14The waste of human potential is staggering. The purpose of the economy should be to enable making full use of it. Instead we focus on profit.
You have to work out a system, then, to figure out who pays to employ the people doing unprofitable work. Not as easy as it sounds.
Re: Millions of educated, experienced workers are tossed aside by a strong economy
#15I find it amazing how much US cares about employment rate. Then people start talking about U3 vs U*. I know they mean something... they always come up.
What I'm curious about these statistics is: how do the statistics track the self-employed?
Seems to me the gig-economy is not about part-time jobs but about part-time self-employment.
So, if you are self-employed and you pay your taxes, from the government's point of view you are OK. But that doesn't mean you are profitable or making a living wage.
In IT, if you are 'benched' the employer pays you regardless. But a 'benched' self-employed person is basically an unemployed that is burning through cash paying taxes, health insurance, etc.
Re: Millions of educated, experienced workers are tossed aside by a strong economy
#16Earlier quoted context omitted.
You would expect that as the largest cohort in modern history retires en mass that the ratio of people in the work force to those outside would start to shift. I think its valid to say that a lot of baby boomers were discouraged post-2008 and perhaps would have worked an extra decade had things been better. But at this point we're well into their retirement years.
Except that, statistically, most baby boomers in the USA have zero to little saved for retirement, and can't afford to retire, and so they keep working.
They have not saved nearly enough but it hasn't stopped them from retiring. The number to watch is the "old-age dependency ratio" which has risen to 25/200 from 21 per 100 in 2010. The trend is for this number to increase as more boomers surpass 65.
As people age their skills and acuity decrease, so while some may want to continue working its not at all a sure thing they'd be able to even if 2008 hadn't happened. I can't think of a good statistic to capture this and we're both looking at second derivative statistics.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/retiring-baby-boomers-leave-the...
Re: Millions of educated, experienced workers are tossed aside by a strong economy
#17Earlier quoted context omitted.
https://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS11300000 There's this. This doesn't exactly back up the claim - there are a lot of reasons people might not be participating.
Especially this: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LNU01300060 25-54 year Labor Paticipation Rate is those that you'd expect to be working but aren't.
The difference between the 25-54 and civilian participation rates are largely attributable to retiring boomers. Participation rates depend heavily on demographics. They matter for things like dependency ratios. But quoting them without the context of a large generation retiring and increasing time spent getting educated hides the full picture. That said, the 3 percentage point drop in 25-54 participation is largely attributable to the opioid crisis—that’s a disturbing start to a trend.
Re: Millions of educated, experienced workers are tossed aside by a strong economy
#18Earlier quoted context omitted.
You would expect that as the largest cohort in modern history retires en mass that the ratio of people in the work force to those outside would start to shift. I think its valid to say that a lot of baby boomers were discouraged post-2008 and perhaps would have worked an extra decade had things been better. But at this point we're well into their retirement years.
Except that, statistically, most baby boomers in the USA have zero to little saved for retirement, and can't afford to retire, and so they keep working.
I know a few people who would have retired except they need the health insurance.
Re: Millions of educated, experienced workers are tossed aside by a strong economy
#19The waste of human potential is staggering. The purpose of the economy should be to enable making full use of it. Instead we focus on profit.
You have to work out a system, then, to figure out who pays to employ the people doing unprofitable work. Not as easy as it sounds.
Yes but also the entire definition of "profitable" vs "unprofitable" work is messed up.
Simple example: The real, measurable costs of pollution - illness, polluted drinking water, etc - are externalized and so companies doing said polluting are "profitable." Would they still be profitable if those costs were not externalized? I suspect not.
Similarly I suspect there are externalities not being accounted for, for self-interested reasons on the parts of those collecting the profit, when assessing which types of work are profitable or not.
Re: Millions of educated, experienced workers are tossed aside by a strong economy
#20Earlier quoted context omitted.
Except that, statistically, most baby boomers in the USA have zero to little saved for retirement, and can't afford to retire, and so they keep working.
I know a few people who would have retired except they need the health insurance.
Isn't medicare better than most private insurance plans?