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VC Tim Draper has revived his proposal to carve California into smaller parts

latimes.com

11–20 of 27 posts

Re: VC Tim Draper has revived his proposal to carve California into smaller parts

#11

Oddly enough, I'm vaguely in favor of this -- but at the same time I don't think it should be implemented. I've lived in a Unitary system (UK) through a bunch of different variations of a Federal system (NZ, Australia, Switzerland, USA, and even EU in a way) -- worth noticing Switzerland apparently was the inspiration for the Californian direct democracy. Each really favors a different set of circumstances. It was sh…

"Each really favors a different set of circumstances. It was shocking in Switzerland to be there for a few votes where people voted to very directly raise taxes."

You may also be interested to know that it is a routine occurrence in the US at the municipality level. While municipalities frequently have normal levels of taxes sufficient to sustain current infrastructure, if a new school or police building or other significant expenditure is required, the town will often vote for releasing a bond and raising the taxes to pay for it. At least where I live, such votes are almost done deals; those measures will typically pass with ~90% of the vote.

"Interested in the counterpoints to all that."

Well, in a pretty real sense, it's precisely the failure of the powers to successfully aggregate that is the driving force here, where "failure" is defined as successfully meeting all the relevant stakeholder's needs. If aggregating powers was awesome and fixed all the problems, nobody would be having this discussion in the first place.

Re: VC Tim Draper has revived his proposal to carve California into smaller parts

#13
post #8

Not a terrible idea. NY should be split as well, maybe then the NYC subway will be fixed. NYC metro area pays 11B more in taxes that takes back. Basically subsidizing the rest of the state while we swelter in subways stuck in tunnels, crappy service, and other nonsense. While there are people in Upstate NY that think that NYC politics occupies the state's agenda too much. I honestly believe the state would be better…

Same thing in the Bay Area. We are 20% the state’s population but pay 40% of the taxes.

Re: VC Tim Draper has revived his proposal to carve California into smaller parts

#14
I'm mildly in favor (or at least not outright opposed) to the similar "State of Jefferson" plan (counties north of Sacramento leave California and join some far-southern Oregon counties to create a new state), which seems to be more obviously supported within the affected counties.

Re: VC Tim Draper has revived his proposal to carve California into smaller parts

#15
post #8

Not a terrible idea. NY should be split as well, maybe then the NYC subway will be fixed. NYC metro area pays 11B more in taxes that takes back. Basically subsidizing the rest of the state while we swelter in subways stuck in tunnels, crappy service, and other nonsense. While there are people in Upstate NY that think that NYC politics occupies the state's agenda too much. I honestly believe the state would be better…

Repairing and upgrading subways would require local political wherewithal that NYC has not demonstrated so far. If Albany is truly draining fare money from MTA your rides might be cheaper but the changes wouldn't happen any faster. But is Albany really getting money from the NYC MTA? I'm skeptical.

Re: VC Tim Draper has revived his proposal to carve California into smaller parts

#16

Is there a government structure where three regions could operate autonomously within a single state of a larger union?

In theory that'd be "counties", but quite a few California counties don't seem to think they have sufficient autonomy (hence this proposal, the Jefferson proposal, etc.).

Re: VC Tim Draper has revived his proposal to carve California into smaller parts

#17
post #8

Not a terrible idea. NY should be split as well, maybe then the NYC subway will be fixed. NYC metro area pays 11B more in taxes that takes back. Basically subsidizing the rest of the state while we swelter in subways stuck in tunnels, crappy service, and other nonsense. While there are people in Upstate NY that think that NYC politics occupies the state's agenda too much. I honestly believe the state would be better…

I'm kind of sad it's come to the point where different regions of America claim they're "subsidizing" other regions populated by other Americans.

I mean, I'm sick of "subsidizing" all the black people in the US; why can't we just kick them all out? (this was sarcasm)

Of course, there is no way for me to know whether or not the time difference between the US and Moscow is significant enough to prevent HackerNews IRA shifts from happening.

Re: VC Tim Draper has revived his proposal to carve California into smaller parts

#18
I’d love to see it broken up. Right now it’s just a guaranteed blue state for Democrats election after election, and many areas of California are getting poor representation. Since we’re currently in the process of shaking up a lot of things maybe it will finally happen.

Re: VC Tim Draper has revived his proposal to carve California into smaller parts

#19
post #8

Not a terrible idea. NY should be split as well, maybe then the NYC subway will be fixed. NYC metro area pays 11B more in taxes that takes back. Basically subsidizing the rest of the state while we swelter in subways stuck in tunnels, crappy service, and other nonsense. While there are people in Upstate NY that think that NYC politics occupies the state's agenda too much. I honestly believe the state would be better…

Same thing in the Bay Area. We are 20% the state’s population but pay 40% of the taxes.

the rest of the state (and country) is paying bonds for the high speed rail project that is essentially a silicon valley commuter train

Re: VC Tim Draper has revived his proposal to carve California into smaller parts

#20
post #12

Interesting. Since the senate is one vote per state, what was California would go from 1 to 3 senators. If carved up in this manner, I wonder how the new states would vote?

The senate is two votes per state... though the ratio works out the same. Clearly the new states would vote more heavily Republican on average than California currently does, else he wouldn't be proposing this. I suspect the big win (for him) electorally would be peeling off votes in the Electoral College. The article mentions union-busting as another motive, which squares with the right-wing motivation.
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