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The link between alcohol and breast cancer

motherjones.com

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Re: The link between alcohol and breast cancer

#11
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article shows that there is good data. One of the more easily interpreted statistics given is that American women on average have a lifetime risk of developing breast cancer of about 12%, while women that consume 2-3 drinks per day have a lifetime risk of about 15%. It's a huge lever for public health to pull on, I guess individuals may not give much thought to moderate consumption.

> One of the more easily interpreted statistics given is that American women on average have a lifetime risk of developing breast cancer of about 12%, while women that consume 2-3 drinks per day have a lifetime risk of about 15%. I find this interesting. By all means, people should be entitled to informed consent and allowed to make their own choices. But only a 3% increase? And that's if you're consuming 2-3 drinks…

Hormone based contraception apparently increases the risk of breast cancer by about 25% too.

>And that's if you're consuming 2-3 drinks a day? Doesn't seem all that significant. //

That was my take away, that's pretty heavy drinking, surely?

Per your last para though, we can address more than one health situation at a time, and need to, it's not just USA with an obesity crisis; UK is deep in to that as well, and probably a lot of other countries.

Re: The link between alcohol and breast cancer

#12
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article shows that there is good data. One of the more easily interpreted statistics given is that American women on average have a lifetime risk of developing breast cancer of about 12%, while women that consume 2-3 drinks per day have a lifetime risk of about 15%. It's a huge lever for public health to pull on, I guess individuals may not give much thought to moderate consumption.

> One of the more easily interpreted statistics given is that American women on average have a lifetime risk of developing breast cancer of about 12%, while women that consume 2-3 drinks per day have a lifetime risk of about 15%. I find this interesting. By all means, people should be entitled to informed consent and allowed to make their own choices. But only a 3% increase? And that's if you're consuming 2-3 drinks…

>But only a 3% increase?

25% increase. 3 percentage points increase.

Re: The link between alcohol and breast cancer

#13
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article shows that there is good data. One of the more easily interpreted statistics given is that American women on average have a lifetime risk of developing breast cancer of about 12%, while women that consume 2-3 drinks per day have a lifetime risk of about 15%. It's a huge lever for public health to pull on, I guess individuals may not give much thought to moderate consumption.

> One of the more easily interpreted statistics given is that American women on average have a lifetime risk of developing breast cancer of about 12%, while women that consume 2-3 drinks per day have a lifetime risk of about 15%. I find this interesting. By all means, people should be entitled to informed consent and allowed to make their own choices. But only a 3% increase? And that's if you're consuming 2-3 drinks…

In relative terms that's a 25% increase.

Re: The link between alcohol and breast cancer

#14

On the whole it seems a good article in raising awareness that alcohol doesn't just cause the almost universally known issues of mouth/throat cancers and liver cirrhosis but also is linked to greater risk of breast cancer [and presumably other not mentioned cancers]. However, it harps on around the suggestion that moderate drinking might be beneficial, and scathes that some studies included ex-drinkers in the "non-dr…

[deleted]

Re: The link between alcohol and breast cancer

#15
post #9

"Corollary 5: The greater the financial and other interests and prejudices in a scientific field, the less likely the research findings are to be true. Conflicts of interest and prejudice may increase bias. Conflicts of interest are very common in biomedical research, and typically they are inadequately and sparsely reported." -- Why Most Published Research Findings are False http://journals.plos.org/plosmedicine/art…

Something that causes cancer is in the headlines every week.

It’s not easy to assess either the relative risks, or the quality of the research without making a career out of it.

Re: The link between alcohol and breast cancer

#16

On the whole it seems a good article in raising awareness that alcohol doesn't just cause the almost universally known issues of mouth/throat cancers and liver cirrhosis but also is linked to greater risk of breast cancer [and presumably other not mentioned cancers]. However, it harps on around the suggestion that moderate drinking might be beneficial, and scathes that some studies included ex-drinkers in the "non-dr…

> Yeah, right, now you lost me completely by trying to cast moderate alcohol use as something that will _make_ me hit my wife

That's not what he says, though. He says alcohol could have that effect. Given that alcohol has notable connections to that effect, it's a reasonable statement. One could argue it's only connected to alcohol abuse, and that's also a reasonable argument, but (a) it's not the only risk related to alcohol consumption (the article notable focuses on cancer) and (b) there's the fact that some portion of the population is at risk for alcohol abuse in a way they are probably not at risk for, say, statin abuse.

> and talking of it as a bad medication.

If we're going to speak of health benefits of alcohol and talk about whether professionals should recommend it, then it's reasonable to compare it to a form of medication.

> You can't walk and have a glass of wine at the weekend?

The question here isn't whether you can do both. Obviously, anyone can. The question is what recommendations are likely to improve outcomes.

The evidence for benefits of alcohol consumption doesn't seem clear. The evidence for some risks does (even if many people who drink never experience them).

So the only people you should tell to take a walk and have a glass of wine are the people who are already having the glass of wine or really really want to for non-health related reasons.

(Or the people who can be confident something else will kill them first and don't need to be unintoxicated in the meanwhile, I suppose.)

> this piece just went of the deep end in lacking perspective and I can no longer trust that it will give me useful advice on keeping alcohol as part of my lifestyle.

The perspective seems pretty straight on to me (and, fwiw, entirely consistent with the advice I've gotten from a handful of doctors including two fancy cardiologists).

Alcohol has risks. The article discusses some and reasons why they may not be adequately appreciated. If that isn't useful as advice while forming an opinion about alcohol as part of your lifestyle, maybe the problem is less the article and more that you're not interested in making that decision based off an understanding of the risks.

And yes, we all accept activities we know have risks, so if drinking is something you enjoy enough you want to accept the measure of risk, fair enough! I do the same with some my own choices. I don't tell myself I'm doing it as part of a health regimen, though, when there are options that seem to have clearer benefits and better risks profiles.

Re: The link between alcohol and breast cancer

#17

This subject needs far more attention than it's getting. It's funny how the psychoactive compound we have the least reliable data on is legal and the most abused while safer and better understood drugs remain illegal. It's fucked up.

By what measure are they better understood?

Re: The link between alcohol and breast cancer

#18

On the whole it seems a good article in raising awareness that alcohol doesn't just cause the almost universally known issues of mouth/throat cancers and liver cirrhosis but also is linked to greater risk of breast cancer [and presumably other not mentioned cancers]. However, it harps on around the suggestion that moderate drinking might be beneficial, and scathes that some studies included ex-drinkers in the "non-dr…

> Yeah, right, now you lost me completely by trying to cast moderate alcohol use as something that will _make_ me hit my wife That's not what he says, though. He says alcohol could have that effect. Given that alcohol has notable connections to that effect, it's a reasonable statement. One could argue it's only connected to alcohol abuse , and that's also a reasonable argument, but (a) it's not the only risk related…

>"Alcohol has risks. The article discusses some and reasons why they may not be adequately appreciated. If that isn't useful as advice while forming an opinion about alcohol as part of your lifestyle, maybe the problem is less the article and more that you're not interested in making that decision based off an understanding of the risks."

I set about intending to share it as advice to those females in my life it could help. It laid heavily in to the notion that moderate alcohol consumption might have health benefits in other areas (heart) - strictly suggesting all the researchers had been bought off by the alcohol lobby.

So then I was searching for the references to the studies excluding prior users ... and viola the smallest confession that recent studies that they don't cite contradict their diatribe.

Alcohol has risks in "public health" including violence, drink driving, etc., but they're not personal risks for a middle aged woman (say) and so are irrelevant.

The professor who said basically that even if alcohol would benefit you they wouldn't recommend it is looking at wider public health, fair enough, but that doesn't help an individual make choices on their lifestyle/diet.

I don't mind drinking, I drink occasionally in part due to papers linking it to better outcomes wrt heart disease.

Re: The link between alcohol and breast cancer

#19
post #15
post #9

"Corollary 5: The greater the financial and other interests and prejudices in a scientific field, the less likely the research findings are to be true. Conflicts of interest and prejudice may increase bias. Conflicts of interest are very common in biomedical research, and typically they are inadequately and sparsely reported." -- Why Most Published Research Findings are False http://journals.plos.org/plosmedicine/art…

Something that causes cancer is in the headlines every week. It’s not easy to assess either the relative risks, or the quality of the research without making a career out of it.

The underlying "cause" of cancer is the cells reverting back to their ancient state of independence and non-cooperation, and all the fail-safes that keep this from happening failing.

The reason for this happening is stress on the cells. And there are more and more things that can cause us cellular stress.

It is a bit of information overload, but if you separate things into "my great-great-grandparents were exposed to this in their daily lives" and "my great-great-grandparents were not exposed to this in their daily lives", you may begin go see a pattern.

And by "exposed to this", I mean looking closely at the exposure type and limits. They might have had wine, and even hard liquor, but probably not available every day.

Re: The link between alcohol and breast cancer

#20
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Something that causes cancer is in the headlines every week. It’s not easy to assess either the relative risks, or the quality of the research without making a career out of it.

The underlying "cause" of cancer is the cells reverting back to their ancient state of independence and non-cooperation, and all the fail-safes that keep this from happening failing. The reason for this happening is stress on the cells. And there are more and more things that can cause us cellular stress. It is a bit of information overload, but if you separate things into "my great-great-grandparents were exposed to…

There's history to suggest that alcohol was used as currency to pay workers in ancient times [1].

Alcohol has been with us for the long haul and has been available to our ancestors in large quantities for most of our history. It's almost engrained in our history.

Not that it makes alcohol healthy but, I don't agree it's safe to just look back and say, "Yo, great-grand-papa could only afford to get wasted once a week - maybe that's the secret?"

[1]: https://arstechnica.com/science/2016/06/5000-year-old-pay-st...

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