Live data from Hacker News

Serverless Security: What's Left to Protect?

infoq.com

11–20 of 20 posts

Re: Serverless Security: What's Left to Protect?

#11

"Since the OS is unreachable" Woah slow down there what? That's a significant presumption. This 'serverless' thing is a fad.

"Since the OS is unreachable": "ideally and theoretically, the OS is behind layers of opaque abstraction and we hope nobody will find security holes to directly access it"

Re: Serverless Security: What's Left to Protect?

#12
"Known vulnerabilities in application libraries are just as risky as those in the server dependencies, and the responsibility for addressing vulnerable app libraries falls to you – the function developer."

This isn't any different from the non-FASS world, but it is a good reminder that you still need someone doing regular maintenance.

Re: Serverless Security: What's Left to Protect?

#13

Admin'ing a system is hard work requiring a deep understanding of many different application, os and network systems, rigorous attention to detail, good communication skills and being subscribed to a variety of fractured news and alert systems to sort out what inbound patches and mitigations are relevant and what can/should be applied. Which leads me to the point of FAAS (and other managed services like Heroku, etc).…

I have no doubt the operators of those networks do - on average - a far better job operating the systems. My concern is that FaaS developers would therefore consider FaaS naturally secure, and forget there are still quite a few security risks they have to tackle themselves.

Re: Serverless Security: What's Left to Protect?

#14
post #6

as a system administrator, I find the summary as laughable as the FAAS movement itself. "FaaS takes on the responsibility for “patching” the underlying servers, freeing you from OS patching" So a sysadm-er, devops admin will be rolling these out and back with CI on a regular basis to dev,test and prod. "Denial of Service (DoS) attacks are naturally thwarted by the (presumed) infinite capacity Serverless offers." Unle…

- A sys admin will not be rolling out OS patches. The platform does itself. - Attackers typically use DoS to make a system unavailable, not just make it expensive to operate. I do note the cost concern, but if attackers are unsuccessful taking a system down, they are less likely to attack it. - I indeed meant "attacking through the OS is unreachable", referring to the portion explaining the OS patches are better managed. It's indeed not perfectly accurate phrasing, but allow a guy some literal freedom in the summary - the details came before.

Re: Serverless Security: What's Left to Protect?

#15
post #5

OS and server stack updates aren’t a case of “more secure”. Somebody still needs to do that work, and you’re trading the responsibility of doing it for the promise that somebody else will (often with no visibility into how and when). DoS is only “solved” by “infinite capacity” insofar as you’re willing to pay for the capacity. If you have any spending caps in place, you’ll be DoSed by burning through your budget. DoS…

The fact OS patching is done by people whose entire job and profession is to keep systems patched matters - they are patched more often and faster. In addition, the fact servers don't live long means it's easier to patch servers (since there's no need to patch a running system). So there's a very real difference here.

Re: Serverless Security: What's Left to Protect?

#16
post #7

I don't necessarily agree with serverless thwarting DoS attacks. While technically it makes it easy to scale to accommodate the increase load (in the same way that auto-scaling will). The denial of a service is the result of your inability to pay for that "infinite" scalability. Personally I'd much rather have to deal with my service being offline for the duration of a DoS attack, then have my company go broke from h…

Fair point. I see the security concern, as far as availability goes, as something FaaS improves, but it's definitely up to you to decide whether downtime is better or worse than a big bill.

Re: Serverless Security: What's Left to Protect?

#20
post #14
post #6

as a system administrator, I find the summary as laughable as the FAAS movement itself. "FaaS takes on the responsibility for “patching” the underlying servers, freeing you from OS patching" So a sysadm-er, devops admin will be rolling these out and back with CI on a regular basis to dev,test and prod. "Denial of Service (DoS) attacks are naturally thwarted by the (presumed) infinite capacity Serverless offers." Unle…

- A sys admin will not be rolling out OS patches. The platform does itself. - Attackers typically use DoS to make a system unavailable, not just make it expensive to operate. I do note the cost concern, but if attackers are unsuccessful taking a system down, they are less likely to attack it. - I indeed meant "attacking through the OS is unreachable", referring to the portion explaining the OS patches are better mana…

Some attackers are perfectly fine with costing a company a ton of money without taking their service down.
Post reply on HN