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Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

thesmartset.com

11–20 of 52 posts

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#11

>disinterested critical discourse is really just a willful schadenfreude? I think the writer has misunderstood the word "schadenfreude". He seems to understand it as "joy you get from hurting somebody else". I always understood SchadenFreude to mean "the joy you get from somebody else's loss or other misfortune" - with no active participation by you in causing it.

Yep. Frankly the whole article felt like watching a little kid put on adult pants and try to convince the adults to take them seriously.

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#14
post #10

The author is essentially saying that criticism is a tool to hurt others. I find this idea interesting, and worthwhile to think about. A question I now have is, in this theory, who does one want to hurt exactly? Is it always the subject of my scorn I want to hurt with criticism, or is it more complicated than that - if I rant about Java on Twitter (I don’t do Java dev anymore), who do I want to hurt? Java devs? Oracl…

The thing that gets me about criticism is that critics themselves often seem to think of it this way when it's aimed at them, when someone dares to take their work and subject it to the same kind of analysis and scrutiny they apply to the work of others. What seems to make it acceptable in the eyes of its worst perpetrators is that they're the ones applying it to others who they think of as inferior on some level.

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#15

>disinterested critical discourse is really just a willful schadenfreude? I think the writer has misunderstood the word "schadenfreude". He seems to understand it as "joy you get from hurting somebody else". I always understood SchadenFreude to mean "the joy you get from somebody else's loss or other misfortune" - with no active participation by you in causing it.

That's correct, and I should mention that Schadenfreude can sometimes even be used with a positive connotation, namely when a bad person suffers some misfortune due to his own wrongdoings.

I think that is actually closer to the usage in English. In English it often seems to be the joy you feel at the misfortune of someone as an outcome of poetic justice.

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#17
post #10

The author is essentially saying that criticism is a tool to hurt others. I find this idea interesting, and worthwhile to think about. A question I now have is, in this theory, who does one want to hurt exactly? Is it always the subject of my scorn I want to hurt with criticism, or is it more complicated than that - if I rant about Java on Twitter (I don’t do Java dev anymore), who do I want to hurt? Java devs? Oracl…

I think it can be a tool to hurt others, and is often used that way by people who probe and learn our psychological weak points, but its proper role is to defend against ideas/culture that one doesn't like.

If some new idea or trend is painful or apparently harmful or even just mildly annoying then it's important to try to understand why and to articulate this in order to protect one's mental integrity. This can be done in private. If one is defending against the actions of another, it may or may not be necessary to communicate the criticism to that other person. Often it is sufficient to silently note why their actions are wrong. (And if one fails to accomplish this, perhaps the actions weren't bad after all. Thus a failed attempt at criticism has changed one's mind about something. This is useful and important.)

Sometimes the criticism must be communicated, perhaps even in the presence of witnesses. This can be hard.

Public criticism is a different matter. There one is trying to protect a subculture from some idea or work that one considers harmful. I'm not sure what are the proper conditions under which to give this or hear this kind of criticism. Perhaps one has the right to be heard only if one can advocate an alternative approach or artwork that is worthy of attention. Or if one has made significant personal contributions to the field.

Note that this comment is a criticism of criticism as it is generally understood and so it makes sense by its own terms. Most of us and most ideas have been the target of unjust criticism at one time or another.

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#18
post #6

>disinterested critical discourse is really just a willful schadenfreude? I think the writer has misunderstood the word "schadenfreude". He seems to understand it as "joy you get from hurting somebody else". I always understood SchadenFreude to mean "the joy you get from somebody else's loss or other misfortune" - with no active participation by you in causing it.

Yeah, joy from inflicting harm is sadism. Author probably just wanted to use the word schadenfreude. It's a really fun word.

It really is a fun word. Always makes me thing of Avenue Q.

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#19
post #6

>disinterested critical discourse is really just a willful schadenfreude? I think the writer has misunderstood the word "schadenfreude". He seems to understand it as "joy you get from hurting somebody else". I always understood SchadenFreude to mean "the joy you get from somebody else's loss or other misfortune" - with no active participation by you in causing it.

Yeah, joy from inflicting harm is sadism. Author probably just wanted to use the word schadenfreude. It's a really fun word.

German has some awesome words: glockenspiel, gesundheit, blitz, panzer...

Re: Let Me Ruin This for You: The Schadenfreude of Criticism

#20
post #10

The author is essentially saying that criticism is a tool to hurt others. I find this idea interesting, and worthwhile to think about. A question I now have is, in this theory, who does one want to hurt exactly? Is it always the subject of my scorn I want to hurt with criticism, or is it more complicated than that - if I rant about Java on Twitter (I don’t do Java dev anymore), who do I want to hurt? Java devs? Oracl…

When I have ranted about Java (thankfully, I don't do much Java development now, and we have Kotlin), I haven't intended to hurt anyone. I just want people to do better. Both in the sense of urging developers to be using better tools than Java, and also in the sense of urging the language designers to fix problems I perceive.

I tend to save my cruelty for those who have been actively trying to harm me. Which doesn't really happen, because I have a relatively placid life.

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