Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others • Hacker News Board

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#11

Post by Insanity » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 9:35 AM UTC

It was a pleasure to read, but of course it should be taken with a grain of salt and not applied to every field :-)

Imagine being in a software team and disregarding what others are doing? Screw the rest of the team, I'll work on my own better solution and ignore the parts that are already working well!

You might end up with a good solution to the problem, but you'll also manage to piss off a lot of people ^^

A more valuable 'quote' from Feynman would be to "Test everything yourself". Don't just take for granted the results of others but verify it yourself. That (in the field of software) can be quite valuable :-)

Still, loved reading that blogpost!

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#12

Post by j7ake » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 9:38 AM UTC

In general it is high risk and high reward. You need to have sufficient confidence in yourself that what you're doing is valuable to a community that is hostile to you. If your work ends up not being recognised as important, then your losses are much larger than if you followed the crowd and did incremental research. There is probably analogous stories with start up scene, incremental start ups get funded, those considered too radical are not given money.

In science it is not obvious whether or not your work will be important or recognised as important until much later.

From the point of view from the entire community it makes sense for individuals to go big risk, but for individuals sometimes you also need to manage your risk differently

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#13

Post by drawkbox » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 9:40 AM UTC

I believe Feynman is saying stay focused on your work, don't get too caught up changing things or keeping up because of other shiny things, you may miss important innovative ideas on your own work. It doesn't mean ignore others work but sometimes it is better to work it through yourself for understanding and then compare. Put all the energy into your work first and foremost.

Same could go with starting a company or product - competition needs to be paid attention to, but if you do it too much it will lead you astray. The product may end up chasing or copycatting while missing out on some innovation that is entirely new and possibly important.

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#14

Post by telesilla » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 9:41 AM UTC

Insanity wrote: post #11

It was a pleasure to read, but of course it should be taken with a grain of salt and not applied to every field :-) Imagine being in a software team and disregarding what others are doing? Screw the rest of the team, I'll work on my own better solution and ignore the parts that are already working well! You might end up with a good solution to the problem, but you'll also manage to piss off a lot of people ^^ A more…

More to the point, consider being the person who decides what that team builds. If you are constantly looking around you, worried about the competition and not trusting your own instinct, you may never build that singular wonderful thing that helps define your career (and gives you energy to pursue difficult things).

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#15

Post by tluyben2 » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 9:48 AM UTC

omegant wrote: post #10

have_faith wrote: post #3

Does this work for Feynman, because he is a genius? in the same way that lots of successful people offer tidbits of advice that wouldn't apply to someone in different circumstances, or perhaps with a different level of intellect.

I think it works for everybody but you need to be brave or crazy enough to apply it. If you pay attention to what the others are doing, you are working inside what is socially acceptable in your group and usually you are not going to go against the stablished truth. Hence you will not be able to add any breakthrough to your area of expertise. Feynman as the post says, experienced this social anxiety once he had the f…

> I think it works for everybody but you need to be brave or crazy enough to apply it.

Depends on what you think 'works' means. You get stuff done but chances are (and these chances are quite significant) no-one will care. If you are a genius (even if you don't recognize that yourself) this works because what you do will be recognized by others. Like writers doing their thing despite what others (including publishers) say; the talents become famous, the much larger group that are not so talented (or, unfortunately, for other reasons) are never read.

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#16

Post by sdrothrock » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 9:52 AM UTC

Insanity wrote: post #11

It was a pleasure to read, but of course it should be taken with a grain of salt and not applied to every field :-) Imagine being in a software team and disregarding what others are doing? Screw the rest of the team, I'll work on my own better solution and ignore the parts that are already working well! You might end up with a good solution to the problem, but you'll also manage to piss off a lot of people ^^ A more…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trust,_but_verify

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#17

Post by srean » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 9:53 AM UTC

Insanity wrote: post #11

It was a pleasure to read, but of course it should be taken with a grain of salt and not applied to every field :-) Imagine being in a software team and disregarding what others are doing? Screw the rest of the team, I'll work on my own better solution and ignore the parts that are already working well! You might end up with a good solution to the problem, but you'll also manage to piss off a lot of people ^^ A more…

> Imagine being in a software team and disregarding what others are doing? Screw the rest of the team, I'll work on my own better solution and ignore the parts that are already working well!

If you are competent, have a realistic estimate of your competence, this might not be a bad idea if what you need is a purely technical solution. In many big organizations (lets leave them nameless) most of your time might be going in navigating the politics, guess-estimating different people's internal incentives and how to steer with or around them, not enough time might remain for thinking about the actual technical problem. In these organizations its necessary to take care of these things, because even if you figured out a great solution that ticked all the technical boxes, including technical compatibility with others, all that will come to nought if it is not in alignment with the social and political aspects.

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#18

Post by iamben » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 10:00 AM UTC

Just based on some of the comments here - I think this loosely translates not as to literally disregard what others are doing, but more to disregard how you _think_ others are interpreting the work that you yourself are doing.

In other words, believe in yourself and everything seems a little easier.

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#19

Post by tome » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 10:03 AM UTC

iamben wrote: post #18

Just based on some of the comments here - I think this loosely translates not as to literally disregard what others are doing, but more to disregard how you _think_ others are interpreting the work that you yourself are doing. In other words, believe in yourself and everything seems a little easier.

I don't think that's the case at all. It explicitly says "You have to worry about your own work and ignore what everyone else is doing", not "ignore how everyone else is interpreting the work you yourself are doing".

Of course this advice isn't good for those who work in a team.

Re: Feynman’s Breakthrough: Disregard Others

#20

Post by meric » Wed, Oct 18, 2017, 10:05 AM UTC

tluyben2 wrote: post #15

omegant wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it works for everybody but you need to be brave or crazy enough to apply it. If you pay attention to what the others are doing, you are working inside what is socially acceptable in your group and usually you are not going to go against the stablished truth. Hence you will not be able to add any breakthrough to your area of expertise. Feynman as the post says, experienced this social anxiety once he had the f…

> I think it works for everybody but you need to be brave or crazy enough to apply it. Depends on what you think 'works' means. You get stuff done but chances are (and these chances are quite significant) no-one will care. If you are a genius (even if you don't recognize that yourself) this works because what you do will be recognized by others. Like writers doing their thing despite what others (including publishers…

I think that's why evolution selects for a small proportion of insanity in humans - so that some of our geniuses are insane enough to ignore social pressure and make breakthroughs that would be recognised.