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Principles for Making New Things (2008)

paulgraham.com

11–20 of 35 posts

Re: Principles for Making New Things (2008)

#11

People look at Reddit and think the founders were lucky. Like all such things, it was harder than it looked. The Reddits pushed so hard against the current that they reversed it I totally understand the difficulties reddit faced (chicken&egg) but I don't understand "pushing hard against the current" part. What current? People love wasting time online and keep looking for new ways of doing it. Yes, getting their atten…

A lot of people look at Reddit now and think "What current?", but it wasn't like that in 2005. The notion that cyberspace was some place you went to waste time was just getting started - Reddit didn't invent it, but they caught the early phases of the wave, and it wasn't at all obvious to everyone. There were no such things as FaceBook apps in 2005. FaceBook itself was limited to college students (or it had just expanded to high school students). There was no Twitter, and no Zynga, and YouTube was just getting started. Most people hadn't heard of Digg, and sites like StackOverflow or Hacker News were far off in the future. Casual games were around, but they didn't make headlines the way they do today.

Yes, there were people who wasted time online, but they were usually people in niche subcultures like fandom or gaming. Many of the early Web 2.0 successes still had a significant productivity bent to them, eg. del.icio.us was seen as a way to organize your bookmarks online, Flickr grew a large community of professional or semi-professional photographers, and blogs were often viewed as a way to increase your professional reputation.

People love wasting time online now, but that was not a mainstream view when Reddit started, and they are perhaps responsible for some of it. That's what PG means by pushing against the current.

Re: Principles for Making New Things (2008)

#13

People look at Reddit and think the founders were lucky. Like all such things, it was harder than it looked. The Reddits pushed so hard against the current that they reversed it I totally understand the difficulties reddit faced (chicken&egg) but I don't understand "pushing hard against the current" part. What current? People love wasting time online and keep looking for new ways of doing it. Yes, getting their atten…

A lot of people look at Reddit now and think "What current?", but it wasn't like that in 2005. The notion that cyberspace was some place you went to waste time was just getting started - Reddit didn't invent it, but they caught the early phases of the wave, and it wasn't at all obvious to everyone. There were no such things as FaceBook apps in 2005. FaceBook itself was limited to college students (or it had just expa…

I don't think that's really true. By 2005, online time-wasting was huge, mainstream big-business. MySpace was sold for $580 million in 2005. I mean, when even Rupert Murdoch thinks social media is the next big thing, it's not exactly a secret.

Re: Principles for Making New Things (2008)

#14
post #8

People say my idea about combing RPG with the focus on self-improvement is a great idea. I don't know what to think but I am building it. EDIT: RPG is role playing game, not Rocket Propelled Grenade.

It is a great idea. Build it.

Well, PG's ideas were considered bad by early opponents. Mine is just considered, well, good.

So I don't have adversaries, just encouragement to build it.

Re: Principles for Making New Things (2008)

#15
post #5

Here it is: I like to find (a) simple solutions (b) to overlooked problems (c) that actually need to be solved, and (d) deliver them as informally as possible, (e) starting with a very crude version 1, then (f) iterating rapidly. Ughh, easier to say than find! :) There are thousands of very, very, very smart people running around looking for "simple solutions to overlooked problems". I like to ask entrepreneurs what…

thanks for posting this pg - for some reason, the startup ideas that keep coming back to my memory (think "open loop" from GTD) actually fits the 6 principles - time to work on crude version 1's I guess :)

Re: Principles for Making New Things (2008)

#16

  Reddit is a classic example of this approach. 
  When Reddit first launched, it seemed like 
  there was nothing to it. To the graphically 
  unsophisticated its deliberately minimal design 
  seemed like no design at all. But Reddit solved 
  the real problem, which was to tell people what 
  was new and otherwise stay out of the way. As a 
  result it became massively successful.
I'm not quite sure Reddit is exactly "massively successful." They just posted the other day about how they aren't making any money. In a capitalist sense, it's not very successful if they aren't making any money.

So how do you define success? Is Arc successful if you open a web page and then 30 minutes later try to submit a form and get "unknown link" or something to that effect. It seems massively broken to me.

I'm not trying to pick on pg. I'm trying to present the alternative which is this: survivor bias. pg may have been in the right place at the right time with viaweb. As an incubator, pg probably made money on reddit, but conde nast has almost certainly lost money on reddit, so I'm on the fence about that.

Continuing on, I think it isn't unsurprising that putting $15k or so into 118 startups over the past 5 years would lead to one or two successes. pg has the benefit of being the magnet, or is it magnate? All the best ideas come to him, but there have only been a small handful of "massive successes" turned out. With his social network and contacts, quite frankly, I expect more big successes than I've seen.

How successful is pg, really? Do we know?

I suppose, really, my point is this: If there was a science to this, then it should be repeatable. Since it doesn't appear that pg has repeated his viaweb success in over 10 years, I wonder where is the science? Is pg just someone we choose to listen to because it feels good? He makes hackers feel good and important and understood? He can empathize with us, so we lend him our ear?

But are we wasting our time?

I love hn, I love listening to pg on stage talk about startups. It's like chicken soup for the startup soul. But maybe I'm being misled. Maybe it's just feel good, irrational stuff that isn't practical or beneficial -- and perhaps even harmful.

How do we know we won't be listening to him and then 10 years from now, we find out he's lost all his viaweb money. He hasn't been able to keep the startup chuck wagon turning out profitable businesses or something like that and we wasted all this time trying to replicate his success because... well... he writes a lot and it feels good to read it...

Re: Principles for Making New Things (2008)

#17
post #8

People say my idea about combing RPG with the focus on self-improvement is a great idea. I don't know what to think but I am building it. EDIT: RPG is role playing game, not Rocket Propelled Grenade.

that's something that a lot of people in Organizational Development would be interested in - you should build it!

Re: Principles for Making New Things (2008)

#18
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is a great idea. Build it.

Well, PG's ideas were considered bad by early opponents. Mine is just considered, well, good . So I don't have adversaries , just encouragement to build it.

It seemed to me that many of Arc's early critics were actually pg's fans, not adversaries. They seemed to have expected too much.

Re: Principles for Making New Things (2008)

#19
post #6

Is Arc a success on the same scale as Viaweb or Y Combinator? In the academic sense ("was it a design that influenced others?") I think the answer is yes. pg's essays about Arc and the language itself got a lot of people thinking about how to improve Lisp. Rich Hickey, creator of Clojure, was influenced to some extent by Arc. In the practical sense ("is the community active and thriving?") I think the answer is no, s…

I prefer it to Scheme or Common Lisp. But while I've spent a decent amount of time on news.arc, I haven't spent much lately on the underlying language.

It turns out I can do a maximum of 2 things at once. I can't work on YC, writing, and hacking. And since YC is a given, that means I have to choose between writing and hacking. Over the last couple years I've mostly chosen writing, but that might change.

Which reminds me, I really should do a new release of news.arc. It's significantly better now.

Re: Principles for Making New Things (2008)

#20

People look at Reddit and think the founders were lucky. Like all such things, it was harder than it looked. The Reddits pushed so hard against the current that they reversed it I totally understand the difficulties reddit faced (chicken&egg) but I don't understand "pushing hard against the current" part. What current? People love wasting time online and keep looking for new ways of doing it. Yes, getting their atten…

A lot of people look at Reddit now and think "What current?", but it wasn't like that in 2005. The notion that cyberspace was some place you went to waste time was just getting started - Reddit didn't invent it, but they caught the early phases of the wave, and it wasn't at all obvious to everyone. There were no such things as FaceBook apps in 2005. FaceBook itself was limited to college students (or it had just expa…

Fark.com was well established in 2005. Reddit added voting.
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