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Blacks and Hispanics Are More Underrepresented at Top Colleges Than 35 Years Ago

nytimes.com

11–20 of 29 posts

Re: Blacks and Hispanics Are More Underrepresented at Top Colleges Than 35 Years Ago

#11
post #2

So just tell them to get better final exams marks?

It's more complex than this. A helpful analysis to start:

http://archive.wilsonquarterly.com/essays/explaining-black-e...

Many don't get the info they can apply: https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2013/09/no-poi...

Re: Blacks and Hispanics Are More Underrepresented at Top Colleges Than 35 Years Ago

#12
post #8

No doubt this is because of the ever increasing cost of going to college in the USA. This favors kids with parents that can pay for some part it, and black and hispanic households tend to have less money than other etnic groups.

The US should probably look at adopting free higher education. It's pretty good, works very well in Sweden and Germany and so on.

Re: Blacks and Hispanics Are More Underrepresented at Top Colleges Than 35 Years Ago

#13
post #8

No doubt this is because of the ever increasing cost of going to college in the USA. This favors kids with parents that can pay for some part it, and black and hispanic households tend to have less money than other etnic groups.

It's a shame the study doesn't compare university enrollment by income.

Re: Blacks and Hispanics Are More Underrepresented at Top Colleges Than 35 Years Ago

#14
post #8

No doubt this is because of the ever increasing cost of going to college in the USA. This favors kids with parents that can pay for some part it, and black and hispanic households tend to have less money than other etnic groups.

> No doubt this is because of the ever increasing cost of going to college in the USA.

Yeah- the focus on admitting 'well rounded' students has a disproportionate impact on the poor.

It's hard to take 50 AP classes, participate in 100 clubs, and buy a humanitarian experience[0] when you're working two jobs outside of school.

[0] https://www.globalbrigades.org/ and such.

Re: Blacks and Hispanics Are More Underrepresented at Top Colleges Than 35 Years Ago

#15
post #7

This sounds like an issue with the public elementary and secondary education systems more than anything else -- affirmative action can only do so much for those that qualify, but if eligibility does not increase in lock step with population then there are some basic problems that need to be addressed. Perhaps college endowment funds[1] should invest in supporting elementary and secondary education systems rather than…

One of the big problems is that in the US school districts are highly local, so economically depressed neighborhoods have far fewer resources to educate children. The US really needs state-wide or metropolitan-wide public school systems that assign students by lottery (assuming that good schools are over-enrolled). This will do a lot to level the playing field, however it's far unlikely to happen for reasons of both class and race.

So that leaves universities to level the playing field. If the US ever gets the K12 education system overhauled maybe can argue against this interventionism from universities, but otherwise how do we start fixing today's problems today?

Re: Blacks and Hispanics Are More Underrepresented at Top Colleges Than 35 Years Ago

#16

From the article: > The share of black freshmen at elite schools is virtually unchanged since 1980. Black students are just 6 percent of freshmen but 15 percent of college-age Americans Leading to an "underrepresentedness" figure of -9 (or -10 on the graph in the article, which is probably due to rounding). But that's a stupid way of calculating underrepresentedness. E.g. if a group has 8 % of the population but none…

There are lies, damned lies, and statistics.

Re: Blacks and Hispanics Are More Underrepresented at Top Colleges Than 35 Years Ago

#17
post #8

No doubt this is because of the ever increasing cost of going to college in the USA. This favors kids with parents that can pay for some part it, and black and hispanic households tend to have less money than other etnic groups.

The US should probably look at adopting free higher education. It's pretty good, works very well in Sweden and Germany and so on.

However there the problem is immigrants not getting proper school education.

https://www.thelocal.se/20110524/33968

Re: Blacks and Hispanics Are More Underrepresented at Top Colleges Than 35 Years Ago

#18
post #8

No doubt this is because of the ever increasing cost of going to college in the USA. This favors kids with parents that can pay for some part it, and black and hispanic households tend to have less money than other etnic groups.

The US should probably look at adopting free higher education. It's pretty good, works very well in Sweden and Germany and so on.

This won't fix the problems of certain groups being excluded though. We have free public schools in the U.S. and these are still some of the most segrarated insitutions, the overwhelming majority of children go to school where their ethnic group or race is the majority.

Re: Blacks and Hispanics Are More Underrepresented at Top Colleges Than 35 Years Ago

#19
I wonder how much of this underrepresentation reflects the underrepresenation of poor students in general.

At 38 colleges in America, including five in the Ivy League – Dartmouth, Princeton, Yale, Penn and Brown – more students came from the top 1 percent of the income scale than from the entire bottom 60 percent.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/01/18/upshot/some-c...

No other kid from my block in East Flatbush was so lucky. At their truly public schools (not charters, not magnets, but common schools available to every family in the neighborhood), they routinely faced atrocious conditions including gun violence, overcrowding, and a curriculum that emphasized obedience over innovation. As outsiders to the college-prep “feeder system,” which includes a small number of competitive high schools including Philips Academy and Trinity, the students who persevere despite these formidable demands and manage to graduate, are rarely seen as “high-achieving” by schools like Yale. From the perspective of prep schoolers who have no grasp of the challenges presented by economic scarcity, the Collegiate Honor Roll Lacrosse captain easily surpasses the Benjamin Banneker High B+ student who lives in a shelter and works at Target after school to help out her single mother and younger siblings. The fantasy that all young people are running the same race blinds many university trustees, administrators, and admissions committees to the reality that they undervalue students who always have to run uphill.

https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/02/why-iv...

Re: Blacks and Hispanics Are More Underrepresented at Top Colleges Than 35 Years Ago

#20
post #7

This sounds like an issue with the public elementary and secondary education systems more than anything else -- affirmative action can only do so much for those that qualify, but if eligibility does not increase in lock step with population then there are some basic problems that need to be addressed. Perhaps college endowment funds[1] should invest in supporting elementary and secondary education systems rather than…

The problem is it isn't primarily the schools, it's the whole environment. A poor student has no time to study because he's busy raising his little sister while his single mother is working two jobs. His neighbors at home try to sell him drugs or recruit him into a gang instead of suggesting that he join the lacrosse team with them.

We keep focusing programs on the very bottom as if the solution is to get literally everyone in the 1st percentile up to the 5th, while ignoring that the 5th percentile is still miserable. What we ought to be doing is fighting the impediments for people at the bottom to break into the middle.

Like, people sell drugs but not sandwiches because the amount of bureaucracy involved in operating a sandwich cart is higher than the margins on sandwiches. Meanwhile selling drugs is fully illegal but the margins are high enough to make up for it.

We've inflated the price of real estate so artificially high by constraining supply that a) people have trouble affording a place to live, but also b) people have trouble affording a place to work -- you can't open a shop if you can't pay the rent.

We keep all of the structural factors that cause their fathers to be in prison rather than in business and then find it shocking that the effects of losing parental income and involvement are more than nothing.

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