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What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

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Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#11

Some context would help here.

A meme has developed among some in Bitcoin - "Fire Core", aka fire the core dev team who have contributed most of the code to the canonical Bitcoin repo ( http://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin ) and stewarded Bitcoin for the last few years ( https://bitcoincore.org ). The argument is that they've moved too slow on important things like scalability, blocked a simple blocksize increase hard fork that would have added capac…

> The counterargument is that there's no other technically credible team in Bitcoin

You forgot the most important counterargument. That they _did_ move extremely fast on scalability. They released a masterpiece of engineering, SegWit, which doubles the blocksize, improves efficiency, enables future efficiency gains, and a laundry list of other improvements ... all while being a softfork. And, IIRC, that was all developed, tested, and released in _very_ short order.

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#12

Why do people seem to assume that those most capable of implementing the cryptography, networking, or other code are also those most capable of understanding the economics of cryptocurrencies or determining their future? Most of the arguments against the core team revolve around the economics and future of the coin, but the tech team seems to think that somehow their coding experience gives them insight into that. Bi…

As someone who used to read /r/bitcoin daily for years, I can confirm this. Economic and business considerations are often disregarded, for example the concept of a "window of opportunity" that one can miss when moving too slowly. But what alienated me most from the Bitcoin-community is how the two most important forums do not value freedom of speech. For example, I've been permanently banned from bitcointalk.org for saying "Thank you Alex! I couldn't agree more."

See: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1842146.msg18340002#...

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A meme has developed among some in Bitcoin - "Fire Core", aka fire the core dev team who have contributed most of the code to the canonical Bitcoin repo ( http://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin ) and stewarded Bitcoin for the last few years ( https://bitcoincore.org ). The argument is that they've moved too slow on important things like scalability, blocked a simple blocksize increase hard fork that would have added capac…

> The counterargument is that there's no other technically credible team in Bitcoin You forgot the most important counterargument. That they _did_ move extremely fast on scalability. They released a masterpiece of engineering, SegWit, which doubles the blocksize, improves efficiency, enables future efficiency gains, and a laundry list of other improvements ... all while being a softfork. And, IIRC, that was all devel…

SegWit is in use by LiteCoin for a year already and the first proposal for Bitcoin was at least two years ago.

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#14
post #8

Why do people seem to assume that those most capable of implementing the cryptography, networking, or other code are also those most capable of understanding the economics of cryptocurrencies or determining their future? Most of the arguments against the core team revolve around the economics and future of the coin, but the tech team seems to think that somehow their coding experience gives them insight into that. Bi…

Well, Alex Morcos (one of the Bitcoin Core developers), is a founder of Hudson River Trading - a HFT firm responsible for 5% of US equities volume [0]. So... I'd say Bitcoin Core has some economic expertise available if they need it. [0] - https://blogs.wsj.com/moneybeat/2014/10/15/inside-hudson-riv...

I didn't know that. But i also work in HFT (have heard of Hudson River plenty of times) and I'm not sure that really gives any extra expertise.

I say BTC lack economic understanding not from some theoretical view but from some of the almost religious decisions that comes from the project (fixed issue, low tx volume, etc). It is almost like they don't want people to use it for anything important.

But i will search out Alex's posts more often though.

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#16

Some context would help here.

A meme has developed among some in Bitcoin - "Fire Core", aka fire the core dev team who have contributed most of the code to the canonical Bitcoin repo ( http://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin ) and stewarded Bitcoin for the last few years ( https://bitcoincore.org ). The argument is that they've moved too slow on important things like scalability, blocked a simple blocksize increase hard fork that would have added capac…

>as a result Ethereum is catching up and on the verge of overtaking Bitcoin

Ironically, scaling ethereum seems a lot dicier than scaling BTC.

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#17
post #3

Some context would help here.

For the past two years, the Bitcoin community has been embroiled in a debate about how to scale the network to handle more transactions. The debate has at times become less technical, rhetoric about "centralization" and the values of the community has become introduced, etc. Recently the debates have come to a head, and some have referred to it as a "Civil War"[0]. For technical background, I recommend these two post…

Both of Hearn's articles contain a number of factually incorrect points. For example, his article on forks states that:

> In a soft fork, a protocol change is carefully constructed to essentially trick old nodes into believing that something is valid when it actually might not be.

The soft-fork protocols used for upgrades are specifically designed to ensure nodes are not tricked into believing something is valid when it might actually not be, as there is a well-defined mechanism - the block header nVersion field - that both co-ordinates soft forks and ensures that nodes that are unaware of the specifics of a given soft-fork know that there are new rules in effect. This is why at present, Bitcoin Core nodes/wallets loudly warn you that unknown rules may be in effect that your node does not understand, because the BIP91 soft-fork just activated that Bitcoin Core does not recognize. (BIP91 is a temporary hack to activate segwit at 80% rather than 95% threshold; in a few weeks it'll no longer be relevant to consensus)

Hearn is misleadingly confusing the adversarial case where a majority of miners may try to change the rules without consent of the community in an undetectable fashion, but that's simply a 51% attack. At present, preventing such attacks is an open research question; conflating the 51% attacks and soft-fork upgrades is very misleading.

In Hearns "resolution of the bitcoin experiment" Hearn states that:

> Bitcoin Core has a brilliant solution to this problem — allow people to mark their payments as changeable after they’ve been sent, up until they appear in the block chain.

and

> How many people would think bitcoins are worth hundreds of dollars each when you soon won’t be able to use them in actual shops?

Here he's referring to zero-confirmation payments and BIP125, Opt-In Replace-By-Fee. First of all, opt-in replace-by-fee is actually derived from Hearns own proposal to re-enable transaction replacement by nSequence. Specifically, Hearn proposed to re-enable an old feature in Bitcoin Core - originally written by Satoshi - that allowed transactions to be replaced if they signalled a higher sequence number. This creates a DoS attack, which I proposed we fix by ensuring that replacements paid a higher fee than the replaced transaction.

Opt-in replace-by-fee is a combination of Hearn's proposal and my own: transactions can signal that they are replacable, and if they signal replacability, can be replaced by transactions paying a higher fee. The combination implements Hearn's desired transaction replacability behavior, while fixing the DoS attack.

The bigger issue is that zero-confirmation transactions are simply not secure: even without the opt-in replace-by-fee that Hearn criticises Bitcoin Core for implementing, it is very easy to double-spend unconfirmed transactions. Soon after Hearn published that post, I did a study which found that every half the wallets tested could be double-spent trivially with nearly 100% success rates, and the other half with about 25% success rates: https://petertodd.org/2016/are-wallets-ready-for-rbf

Unfortunately, Hearn is simply being dishonest on both counts here, something that got him wide condemnation in the technical community.

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#18
post #15

This "fire Core" situation reminds me of Uber. You can be killing it 24/7 and still get fired if you cause enough non-technical damage.

Bitcoin is supposed to be a currency, so there are many non-technical aspects of it that need to be properly handled. If the people working on the code take it upon themselves to make the non-technical decisions too, they need to be held responsible for the outcome.

This really gets at the heart of my dislike for cryptocurrency -- most proponents believe it's supposed to be decentralized and free from the control of government, but it's actually centralized under the control of a small group of unelected programmers (who seem to misunderstand how human societies, currencies, and contracts actually work), and there is no recourse when they make bad decisions except to fork the blockchain and the code. It's really a step backwards in terms of governance compared to, say, fiat currency with democratic governance. This applies to most cryptocurrencies I've seen, not just bitcoin.

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#19
post #10

The whole point of open source software is that you can fork a project away from the original developers.

But the point of a currency is to be a stable and widely accepted medium of exchange. Forking undermines both of those goals.

If the US dollar forked, or an EU country left the Euro, it would widely be considered a disaster and a failure of politics and governance. Why should bitcoin be held to a different standard?

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#20

Why do people seem to assume that those most capable of implementing the cryptography, networking, or other code are also those most capable of understanding the economics of cryptocurrencies or determining their future? Most of the arguments against the core team revolve around the economics and future of the coin, but the tech team seems to think that somehow their coding experience gives them insight into that. Bi…

Can you explain what a "long term counteract" is and how it relates to a currency's inflation rate?
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