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Americans think they live in a democracy. But workplaces are small tyrannies

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Re: Americans think they live in a democracy. But workplaces are small tyrannies

#11

Post by justadeveloper2 »

djmips wrote: post #4

Yep, and then people said we need a businessman running America and surprise they got someone who wants to run it like a dictatorship.

I don't see it that way at all. Trump is not responsible for what has taken place here, as fun as it is to blame him. I see him as someone who is trying to undo a lot of the problems and fix them but he has no support from either the Democrats or the Republicans because both sides are vested in continuing the slave plantation that we have here in service of the ultra .01%. In Trump, we have a guy who is part of the system who has rebelled from it because he no longer could live with what he saw it doing and what he knwos it to be. He deserves a little bit of sympathy and the American people deserve credit for finally waking up to what is going on. It's going to take more than one guy to fix this, though. I don't hold out a lot of hope. It is what it is now--we're headed for third world style living, and let's be honest--a large number of Americans are already living in third world squalor. It's not "heading" it's here.

Re: Americans think they live in a democracy. But workplaces are small tyrannies

#12

Post by sharemywin »

empthought wrote: post #8
sharemywin wrote: post #6

generally because most people work better with supervision. For the person that downvoted me what are you doing on HN in the middle of the day if you're so personally motivated.

This guy doesn't understand time zones.

good point. but I'm still right.

Re: Americans think they live in a democracy. But workplaces are small tyrannies

#13

Post by aaronhoffman »

The article mentions that the industrial revolution has made it too difficult for small business to compete with large companies.

To solve that problem, let's eliminate all taxes for everyone making less than $100k. No income tax, no payroll tax, no property tax, no sales tax, no...

Re: Americans think they live in a democracy. But workplaces are small tyrannies

#14

Post by Jabanga »

I hate to get pedantic, but with the misuse of terms for the purpose of demagoguing against those with more capital, I feel compelled to point out that an employment relationship is wholly contractual, and therefore not a "tyranny", and perfectly consistent with a completely democratic society.

Maybe the author means "egalitarian" or some other concept tangentially related to democracy. Voluntarily formed hierarchies are perfectly consistent with a free and democratic society.

But points to the author on hitting people's emotional buttons with her victim/outrage politics.

Re: Americans think they live in a democracy. But workplaces are small tyrannies

#15

Post by trendia »

Jabanga wrote: post #14

I hate to get pedantic, but with the misuse of terms for the purpose of demagoguing against those with more capital, I feel compelled to point out that an employment relationship is wholly contractual, and therefore not a "tyranny", and perfectly consistent with a completely democratic society. Maybe the author means "egalitarian" or some other concept tangentially related to democracy. Voluntarily formed hierarchies…

This is my disagreement with the article as well. I agree with the author that Amazon Fulfillment should need to give employees adequate breaks, but I don't agree that the rules make Amazon a government: they don't have law enforcement, a court system, the power to make laws, an army, etc. At least a majority of these are necessary to be considered a government.

Re: Americans think they live in a democracy. But workplaces are small tyrannies

#17

Post by calafrax »

It is interesting that no one with money believes that democracy is a credible way to run a business and yet people still believe it is a credible way to run a government.

Fun fact: the US Constitution has exactly ZERO uses of the word "democracy" in it.

Re: Americans think they live in a democracy. But workplaces are small tyrannies

#18

Post by kerkeslager »

calafrax wrote: post #17

It is interesting that no one with money believes that democracy is a credible way to run a business and yet people still believe it is a credible way to run a government. Fun fact: the US Constitution has exactly ZERO uses of the word "democracy" in it.

There are numerous examples of cooperatives, businesses that are run democratically, which are successful. Sure, no one amasses huge piles of money that way, just like nobody in a (effective) democracy amasses huge amounts of power. But that's kind of the point. Saying nobody with money thinks democracy is a good way to run a business is like saying no dictators with power think democracy is a good idea. It's not a criticism of democracy/cooperatives, it's an obvious statement of the motivations of dictators/business leaders.

Re: Americans think they live in a democracy. But workplaces are small tyrannies

#19

Post by cphoover »

Jabanga wrote: post #14

I hate to get pedantic, but with the misuse of terms for the purpose of demagoguing against those with more capital, I feel compelled to point out that an employment relationship is wholly contractual, and therefore not a "tyranny", and perfectly consistent with a completely democratic society. Maybe the author means "egalitarian" or some other concept tangentially related to democracy. Voluntarily formed hierarchies…

Haven't read the article... but my response to you is that not every "contractual" agreement is voluntary. Think people working minimum wage jobs to feed their children, or children working in sweatshops in asia.

I get what you are saying... that it is a click bait title, but the fact remains that the late-stage capitalistic hierarchies that form are not totally unlike other labor systems (indentured servitude/slavery) that we have generally deemed as immoral.

Re: Americans think they live in a democracy. But workplaces are small tyrannies

#20

Post by ctulek »

trendia wrote: post #15
Jabanga wrote: post #14

I hate to get pedantic, but with the misuse of terms for the purpose of demagoguing against those with more capital, I feel compelled to point out that an employment relationship is wholly contractual, and therefore not a "tyranny", and perfectly consistent with a completely democratic society. Maybe the author means "egalitarian" or some other concept tangentially related to democracy. Voluntarily formed hierarchies…

This is my disagreement with the article as well. I agree with the author that Amazon Fulfillment should need to give employees adequate breaks, but I don't agree that the rules make Amazon a government: they don't have law enforcement, a court system, the power to make laws, an army, etc. At least a majority of these are necessary to be considered a government.

If the government backs your inhuman activities, you practically have all these institutions at your disposal.
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