I shared my toddler's hospital bill on Twitter • Hacker News Board

Re: I shared my toddler's hospital bill on Twitter

#11

Post by ajmurmann » Sat, Jul 08, 2017, 6:06 AM UTC

toomuchtodo wrote: post #4

Aloha wrote: post #3

Part of why healthcare is so expensive today, is we're capable of saving so many more lives than before. As little as a generation ago, many more would have died, people who now go on to live fruitful productive lives.

America spends more per capita than any other first world country for worse outcomes [1]. Healthcare is expensive because of the profit motive. Single payer isn't implemented for (mostly) the same reason. 60% of Americans want single payer [2]. "A majority of Americans say it is the federal government’s responsibility to make sure all Americans have health care coverage. And a growing share now supports a “single pay…

I used to be for single part until I listened to a recent episode of econtalk (http://www.econtalk.org/archives/2017/06/christy_ford_ch.htm...). Christy Ford described how the current medical system evolved and how the American Medical Association made the current, insurance based system happen. Before this we used to for example multi-disciplineray offices of doctors that you could directly buy health care coverage from. That was made illegal. What we currently have is the worst of any world. It's a artificially constrained market that's practically devoid of competition. On top of that we have insurance which is clearly the wrong model for something you know you are going to need. And it's employer provided on top of it. How could this market possibly be less functional? Let's try to fix the market before we pour out the baby with the bath water.

Re: I shared my toddler's hospital bill on Twitter

#12

Post by secabeen » Sat, Jul 08, 2017, 6:06 AM UTC

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #7

Based on the background of the mother, she would have been able to have had insurance even without Obamacare, and would have still been able to have insurance no matter what the Republican Congress passes. In this situation, no matter what the government did, her child would still have been able to get the necessary surgery. In addition, Boston Children's Hospital is one of the premier hospitals in the world. Given t…

I'm not so sure that's true. While it's likely that the mother would have had insurance pre-Obamacare, it could have very easily had a lifetime maximum. Given that this is his 4th surgery (at $200k each), plus NICU and other costs from his birth, and they are probably looking at at least $1mil in total expenses so far. In a pre-Obamacare world, they could be reaching the end of the funds available for his care.

Re: I shared my toddler's hospital bill on Twitter

#13

Post by toomuchtodo » Sat, Jul 08, 2017, 6:07 AM UTC

ajmurmann wrote: post #11

toomuchtodo wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

America spends more per capita than any other first world country for worse outcomes [1]. Healthcare is expensive because of the profit motive. Single payer isn't implemented for (mostly) the same reason. 60% of Americans want single payer [2]. "A majority of Americans say it is the federal government’s responsibility to make sure all Americans have health care coverage. And a growing share now supports a “single pay…

I used to be for single part until I listened to a recent episode of econtalk ( http://www.econtalk.org/archives/2017/06/christy_ford_ch.htm... ). Christy Ford described how the current medical system evolved and how the American Medical Association made the current, insurance based system happen. Before this we used to for example multi-disciplineray offices of doctors that you could directly buy health care coverag…

I have to respectfully disagree. It's time to burn down the current system and go straight to single payer.

Collect premiums via payroll taxes->fund healthcare providers. That greatly simplifies it, but there are many other first world models we can pick from. This is not hard.

Re: I shared my toddler's hospital bill on Twitter

#14

Post by quantummkv » Sat, Jul 08, 2017, 6:11 AM UTC

Am i missing something in here or are the costs in that bill really this high? $22,526 for room boarding for 2 weeks? Over here in India my grandma's bypass surgery costed somewhat about $10,000. That included everything including the stent, medicines and boarding, that too at a renowned, premiere private hospital.

Is this a special case or are healthcare costs generally this high in America?

Re: I shared my toddler's hospital bill on Twitter

#15

Post by divbit » Sat, Jul 08, 2017, 6:12 AM UTC

mnm1 wrote: post #2

It's depressing to me to think that people hate others so much that they would go to such great lengths to keep others from getting healthcare and ensure their demise. These same people would have no problem accepting healthcare from others if it was their lives that were in danger. I truly cannot fathom the hypocrisy, hate, and cruelty that must exist in these people's hearts towards their fellow citizens.

It is really such a sad story - I'm glad that this mother seems to have been able to get her costs down at least (if I read the story correctly), sad that probably there are others that can't. We must all learn to love and forgive one another

Re: I shared my toddler's hospital bill on Twitter

#16

Post by justboxing » Sat, Jul 08, 2017, 6:21 AM UTC

quantummkv wrote: post #14

Am i missing something in here or are the costs in that bill really this high? $22,526 for room boarding for 2 weeks? Over here in India my grandma's bypass surgery costed somewhat about $10,000. That included everything including the stent, medicines and boarding, that too at a renowned, premiere private hospital. Is this a special case or are healthcare costs generally this high in America?

> are healthcare costs generally this high in America

Yes they are ridiculously high, even after factoring in cost of living / currency rates or as a %age of monthly salary, if you are comparing it to costs in a different country. 1 month after coming here (to America) from India (1999) I had to get wax from my left ear cleaned as it was blocking my hearing.

They squirted some liquid in my ear and got the wax out. 2 weeks later, I got the insurance Statement. It cost $ 800. I was astonished. In India a year before, I'd paid a Doc 100 Rupees (at that time, $2 equivalent in USD) for the same exact thing.

A month later, I had a chest x-ray taken, and some weird quirk in insurance it wasn't covered. So I had to boot the bill. $ 576 for 1 single chest x-ray. My take home at that time as a software engineer was about 2500 / month after tax and deductions, so this was 23% of my paycheck!

Health Insurance coverage is too closely tied to employment. In order to get continued coverage, you are more or less working "for the man" till you die.

Re: I shared my toddler's hospital bill on Twitter

#17

Post by anilgulecha » Sat, Jul 08, 2017, 6:21 AM UTC

quantummkv wrote: post #14

Am i missing something in here or are the costs in that bill really this high? $22,526 for room boarding for 2 weeks? Over here in India my grandma's bypass surgery costed somewhat about $10,000. That included everything including the stent, medicines and boarding, that too at a renowned, premiere private hospital. Is this a special case or are healthcare costs generally this high in America?

Apropos the topic at hand, I want to post a picture I recently took at a hospital here in Bangalore, outlining patient rights.

http://imgur.com/a9axFK2

The first one is the right to an informed choice, including information upfront about the price of treatments.

Re: I shared my toddler's hospital bill on Twitter

#18

Post by holydude » Sat, Jul 08, 2017, 6:24 AM UTC

In my country somewhere in europe you pay ridiculous taxes and you cannot opt out. The healthcare is shit, corrupt and if you want good care when they do not treat you like shit you need to go private and pay extra. Beware americans with your mentality you end up paying more ans getting less with programs like obamacare.

Re: I shared my toddler's hospital bill on Twitter

#19

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Jul 08, 2017, 6:34 AM UTC

quantummkv wrote: post #14

Am i missing something in here or are the costs in that bill really this high? $22,526 for room boarding for 2 weeks? Over here in India my grandma's bypass surgery costed somewhat about $10,000. That included everything including the stent, medicines and boarding, that too at a renowned, premiere private hospital. Is this a special case or are healthcare costs generally this high in America?

[deleted]

Re: I shared my toddler's hospital bill on Twitter

#20

Post by RcouF1uZ4gsC » Sat, Jul 08, 2017, 6:36 AM UTC

lstamour wrote: post #10

hkmurakami wrote: post #5

> It was eye-opening to see just how low our discourse has sunk, to be forced to acknowledge that what passes for debate in the age of the internet is often nothing more than spewing venom at the other side. How are we ever supposed to find a solution that’s better than either Trumpcare or Obamacare if we can’t even shut up long enough to recognize the humanity in the people on the other side of the debate? So people…

Who sets the numbers and why, though? How much is profit, how much should be profit, when it comes to human health and rehabilitation whether mental or physical assistance is required? Or, ignoring profit, why take away public funding to programs for poor people just to provide tax breaks to rich folks? How much is a dollar worth to each individual, relatively-speaking? There are few easy answers, except (almost) eve…

> Just to provide tax breaks to rich folks

Your statement illustrates one of two competing views. The following statements are extremes of the two positions.

1) The government by default owns all your money, and any money you get to keep after taxes is just a tax break.

2) You own your money by default, and the government should not take your money except to provide things that the market is unable to (some examples of which are law enforcement, military).

Those who espouse one of these views, tend to see people who espouse the other as morally wrong and evil.