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Leaked email from United Airlines CEO blames passenger for violent removal

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11–20 of 274 posts

Re: Leaked email from United Airlines CEO blames passenger for violent removal

#11
I think the video of this incident is frankly disgusting, but it's not clear without more context why the situation escalated to the degree it did. For example, UA fly another plane 3 hours 20 minutes later to the same destination (which is to say, a very reasonable and perfectly expectable delay in any situation involving air travel), why did the doc need to be on exactly that plane, and why did the UA staff also have to be on exactly that plane?

One point in favour of UA though, is that they're perfectly within their right to deny boarding for any reason whatsoever. Yes, it's completely a dick move on their part, but just because they're acting like dicks does not give a passenger the right to refuse disembarkation, it's not his aircraft.

FWIW I 100% think the passenger was mistreated regardless, just saying there aren't enough facts to pass judgement so easily

Re: Leaked email from United Airlines CEO blames passenger for violent removal

#12
post #6

The fact that the airline technically didn't do anything illegal here really speaks to the lack of consumer protection laws in this country.

Some people appear to think that what they did wasn't legal. See:

http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/593329-usa-today-ua-forci...

Re: Leaked email from United Airlines CEO blames passenger for violent removal

#13
I feel the current system of overbooking and how it is "regulated" is backwards, and airlines should rethink. Perhaps they could do some sort of an auction without a maximum. It is their problem after all, and a market mechanism seems a reasonable way to deal with this. Sometimes this would mean someone who does not care as much will gladly take $150 as compensation. Other cases might lead to much higher numbers.

The next bit will probably not make me particularly popular, seeing most of the reactions to this debacle, but here goes.

The airplane itself is not a suitable place for any form of protest. No ifs, buts or anything else.

Once the flight personnel asks you to leave the airplane, you leave. Take the fight outside of the airplane, in court or wherever or however you deem appropriate. But not on the plane. Your work/patients/personal tragedy is in no way relevant. If you disagree with the service offered, don't use it. Vote with your feet and your wallet. Don't claim you have no alternatives or whatever. Society does not owe you your preferred lifestyle in any way.

If this guy refused to leave after he was asked to do so, according to the rules het agreed by upon entering an agreement, and I would be delayed by the ensuing situation, I would even consider pursuing some form of legal action towards him.

Having said all that, I do feel the way commercial air travel is organised these days is beyond ridiculous. I therefore avoid it whenever and however I can. If more people did that, it would have changed by now. People don't, so it doesn't. Because most just feel entitled to whatever they feel entitled to, without any basis. Fuck them.

Oh, and screw airlines too.

Re: Leaked email from United Airlines CEO blames passenger for violent removal

#14
post #10

Rough. I can see where he's coming from though. This was a private email to employees, and in that context he definitely needs to be a cheerleader for them. Overbookings are industry standard, and they called security for someone who wouldn't leave. "Correct" protocol. I think what most likely happened is the security guard that has been placed on leave did his job very poorly. As soon as he hit the passenger his cow…

If you are the CEO of a public company, you know anything you write at all@ is, most likely, public record.

"They were just following protocol" is the new "Befehl ist Befehl" - also known as Nurember defense https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superior_orders

The fact that a defenceless man has left a plane covered in blood should give everyone pause. They followed orders is a very poor response.

Re: Leaked email from United Airlines CEO blames passenger for violent removal

#15
Ignoring the physical assault, this sounds about par for United customer support...

I've been avoiding United for years, but a few years ago, a few friends wanted to be picked up at the airport after United flights. Over 50% of them bought tickets for flights that didn't exist, and were instead consolidated onto other, later, flights.

Airlines should have to pay large multiples of ticket prices (in cash) to passengers that encounter a schedule change or overbooking. As the overbookings increase, the refunds should grow exponentially. (2x if 0.1% are bumped, 4x if 0.2, then 8x, 16x, etc).

If they didn't change their behavior, United would have to pay out its market cap in a matter of days, which is exactly what they deserve for systematically abusing customers for at least a decade.

Re: Leaked email from United Airlines CEO blames passenger for violent removal

#16

Doesn't anyone with an ounce of PR sense work at this company? No one is impressed by the legal technicalities. No one cares that the internal policies were followed. If they want to get out ahead of this they need to understand and come to grips with the fact that they are well nigh universally perceived to have been in the wrong.

United is somewhat famous, even in the generally unfriendly airline industry, for being ham-handed around PR and customer relations.

See http://untied.com, a parody/complaint site.

Re: Leaked email from United Airlines CEO blames passenger for violent removal

#17

I feel the current system of overbooking and how it is "regulated" is backwards, and airlines should rethink. Perhaps they could do some sort of an auction without a maximum. It is their problem after all, and a market mechanism seems a reasonable way to deal with this. Sometimes this would mean someone who does not care as much will gladly take $150 as compensation. Other cases might lead to much higher numbers. The…

I completely disagree with your advice. If you truly care about something you should protest against it immediately.

Re: Leaked email from United Airlines CEO blames passenger for violent removal

#18

I feel the current system of overbooking and how it is "regulated" is backwards, and airlines should rethink. Perhaps they could do some sort of an auction without a maximum. It is their problem after all, and a market mechanism seems a reasonable way to deal with this. Sometimes this would mean someone who does not care as much will gladly take $150 as compensation. Other cases might lead to much higher numbers. The…

The problem with your logic is giving private companies complete rights over your physical person once you enter their plane will (and does as shown by the incident) lead to abuse for profit.

There was no security issue, there was no emergency, there was no legitimate reason to remove this person from the plane. The abuse and physical harm of a passenger was done entirely in the name of saving a few dollars by not sending their staff on another flight.

This was wrong and it was an abuse of the security personal to enforce their monetary needs.

Separately, the security personal should be fired -- for also being utterly unprofessional, unable to read the scenario, and reacting with unnecessary force.

Re: Leaked email from United Airlines CEO blames passenger for violent removal

#20
While I'm sure it's possible an employee forwarded this email without official authorization, it is unlikely this email was written without the expectation that it would eventually make its way into the press. IOW, it's been written with the public as its ultimate audience, I wouldn't assume that it has anything that the CEO didn't want the world to know.
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