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How FarmVille Designs for Engagement

philmichaelson.com

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Re: How FarmVille Designs for Engagement

#11

Post by dpcan »

NEPatriot wrote: post #6
someone_here wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've had a chat with someone who used to work for Zynga, and he said it was a great place to work. He said they knew full well the psychology of what they were doing, and were quite proud of how well they do.

I wonder if they hired psychologists for this?

I would doubt it. Maybe the creators caught wind of it in a psych 101 class, but we learned about micro-achievements years ago just by being gamers, and they just happened to master it.

Super Mario Bros.

Think of the "levels" of achievement:

1) On the smallest level, you kill small enemies, get a "big" mushroom. You get points, and your environment changes.

2) On the next level, you collect coins. 100 means an extra life.

3) Then you beat the sub-levels, 1-1, 1-2, 1-3

4) Finally you beat a "boss" and go to the next "World" to 2-1, 2-1

5) Beat 8 "Worlds" and the "big boss" and you beat the game.

6) Advanced players will compete for the best times, try to create fireworks over the castles, find warp zones, or max out their points.

The key is in progressive achievements and always wanting more. You create a sense of urgency or need and you have someone in the palm of your hand.

Business is no different. I just upgraded my Basecamp account so I could add the "Time" module. I'm on World 2 now.

Re: How FarmVille Designs for Engagement

#12

Post by zach »

NEPatriot wrote: post #6
someone_here wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've had a chat with someone who used to work for Zynga, and he said it was a great place to work. He said they knew full well the psychology of what they were doing, and were quite proud of how well they do.

I wonder if they hired psychologists for this?

Who needs psychologists when you have game designers? Psychological literature doesn't have the level of interest or experience in the practical applications that expert game designers have.

Re: How FarmVille Designs for Engagement

#13

Post by ryanjmo »

phil_KartMe wrote: post #10

If HackerNew wanted to become more like FarmVille (not that it should), the system could: * give you karma just for stopping by each day * give you karma for upvoting other's posts * give you profiles you could customize by trading in karma * show you what your friends were upvoting and their Karma * show you how close you were to attaining moderator status * allow you to give one virtual gift per day to your favorit…

Ha, the sad part is if they did this, I would likely use HN even more.

Re: How FarmVille Designs for Engagement

#14

Post by ThomPete »

The problem with this kind of advice although interesting is that is takes something hugely popular and present it as the reason why farmville is working.

I am not so sure it's that simple. The real challenge imho is to show how to get critical mass. Not to talk about how you optimize once you have it.

Does anyone know exactly the reason why farmville became popular, cause somehow I think it's not about those 8 principles?

Re: How FarmVille Designs for Engagement

#15

Post by phil_KartMe »

ThomPete wrote: post #14

The problem with this kind of advice although interesting is that is takes something hugely popular and present it as the reason why farmville is working. I am not so sure it's that simple. The real challenge imho is to show how to get critical mass. Not to talk about how you optimize once you have it. Does anyone know exactly the reason why farmville became popular, cause somehow I think it's not about those 8 princ…

I didn't mean to imply this article was about how FarmVille started or grew.

This history of FarmVille implies it was better game mechanics than Farm Town, and Zynga's installed base, that lead to FarmVille's success: http://www.allfacebook.com/2010/01/farmville-history/.

I'd also hypothesize that Zynga grew because they:

* Had a working revenue model, so they could pay for advertising without burning cash. And being able to advertise in the place where someone plays is helpful for conversions.

* Built on a growing platform (i.e., Facebook)

Re: How FarmVille Designs for Engagement

#16

Post by dmix »

ryanjmo wrote: post #13
phil_KartMe wrote: post #10

If HackerNew wanted to become more like FarmVille (not that it should), the system could: * give you karma just for stopping by each day * give you karma for upvoting other's posts * give you profiles you could customize by trading in karma * show you what your friends were upvoting and their Karma * show you how close you were to attaining moderator status * allow you to give one virtual gift per day to your favorit…

Ha, the sad part is if they did this, I would likely use HN even more.

It would be more appropriate for Digg.

Re: How FarmVille Designs for Engagement

#17

Post by benmathes »

phil_KartMe wrote: post #2

If anyone has other thoughts on lessons to learn from FarmVille, let me know!

Something I learned from working at a large competitor at Zynga (where there was some employee cross-pollenation): A/B test the hell out of your ideas. Going from "making my app more social" to "Put vacant lots on users' farms to get them to add friends" means playing with lots of different ideas. What exactly clicks depends heavily and all the myriad details of your app and userbase.

Re: How FarmVille Designs for Engagement

#18

Post by Brendan_Scully »

Yes, but this method could also be applied to building better slot machines. The game itself requires very little skill or creative engagement on the part of the player. Farmville is evil game design; it takes advantage of human cognitive hooks and limitations for the purpose of profit.

Video games should expand upon what we are capable of. Reward structures and timed events are fine to a degree, but Zynga goes too far. This kind of manipulation needs to be addressed, especially as games become more and more thoroughly integrated with our society.

Re: How FarmVille Designs for Engagement

#19

Post by Brendan_Scully »

zach wrote: post #12
NEPatriot wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if they hired psychologists for this?

Who needs psychologists when you have game designers? Psychological literature doesn't have the level of interest or experience in the practical applications that expert game designers have.

And these games are just getting started. As they grow, these tricks will get worse. This is a MUCH bigger problem than people realize. If you could have prevented the introduction of Opium to China, would you have?

http://www.vizworld.com/2010/02/jesse-schells-dice-2010-pres...

Re: How FarmVille Designs for Engagement

#20

Post by cadr »

I've never played FarmVille, but one of the things I loved about Kingdom of Loathing (other than the general awesomeness) was that I could only do so much at a time - I didn't feel like I had to commit to it if I just had a few minutes. And the fact that each day you got more adventures, it really encouraged me to keep coming back.

Oddly, it was at the point where I had more adventures in a day than I had time to use (and therefore started loosing them) was the point that I started to loose interest.

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