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Australian welfare recipient’s data released to counter public criticism

theguardian.com

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Re: Australian welfare recipient’s data released to counter public criticism

#11

Post by literallycancer »

yosamino wrote: post #8

This is a good example of why the "I don't have anything to hide" argument is incorrect. That way of thinking only works as long as your goals and positions are aligned with the entity collecting information about you to begin with. If they're not, or the situation changes, imbalances of information lead to disadvantages for you pretty quickly. All it took was some bureaucrat feeling petty.

And this is how it looks in the 3rd world.[1]

On 31 October, Congress party officials provided assailants with voter lists, school registration forms, and ration lists.[49] The lists were used to find the location of Sikh homes and business, an otherwise impossible task because they were located in unmarked and diverse neighbourhoods. On the night of 31 October, the night before the massacres began, assailants used the lists to mark the houses of Sikhs with letter "S".[49] In addition, because most of the mobs were illiterate, Congress Party officials provided help in reading the lists and leading the mobs to Sikh homes and businesses in the other neighbourhoods.[46] By using the lists the mobs were able to pinpoint the locations of Sikhs they otherwise would have missed.[46]

... One man, Amar Singh, escaped the initial attack on his house by having a Hindu neighbour drag him into his neighbour's house and declare him dead. However, a group of 18 assailants later came looking for his body, and when his neighbour replied that others had already taken away the body an assailant showed him a list and replied, "Look, Amar Singh's name has not been struck off from the list so his dead body has not been taken away."[46]

1 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1984_anti-Sikh_riots#Use_of_vo...

Re: Australian welfare recipient’s data released to counter public criticism

#12

Post by mdpopescu »

josephg wrote: post #9
cyberferret wrote: post #7

No doubting the veracity of this occurrence, but it is baffling that it happened nonetheless - federal government departments here (Australia) are usually cautious to a paranoid level when it comes to people even looking at information. I remember cases when curious internal staff members at the tax and social security offices being sacked on the spot for merely doing searches on celebrity names without due reason. B…

I'm an Australian who lived a couple of years in the Bay Area. The views people hold toward privacy was one of the most surprising cultural differences between our countries. As an outsider I was shocked to learn that privacy really is an afterthought for a lot of bay area residents. US anecdote: a product I worked on had a feature which needs full access to a customer's email account to use. The feature scrapes thei…

I worked on a financial product based on one of Intuit's. I was shocked to realize that this Intuit product was impersonating people (using their username and password) to log on to their bank accounts and download all transactions - which our product was then analyzing. I was sure nobody would allow that; who will give a third-party their bank username and password?

I was extremely surprised to find out that the answer was "at least tens of thousands of people".

Re: Australian welfare recipient’s data released to counter public criticism

#13

Post by briane80 »

This story follows a pattern of coordinated attacks on public services in The Guardian and other left leaning media outlets. Usually with the agenda of demanding more money and funding.

No doubt, mistakes happen in large bureaucracies but the story is usually slanted as some evil agency trying to destroy certain 'marginalised' sections of society. Whereas the truth is probably nothing like that.

I cannot help but think it is agenda pushing, distortion of facts and playing on emotions. Read the woman's original article and see the emotional language and phrases used. I think it says a lot about the intent of these media pieces.

Read the linked Centrelinks response and several things are refuted, so why in these comments is there an automatic pile on one side?

Re: Australian welfare recipient’s data released to counter public criticism

#14

Post by feld »

mdpopescu wrote: post #12
josephg wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm an Australian who lived a couple of years in the Bay Area. The views people hold toward privacy was one of the most surprising cultural differences between our countries. As an outsider I was shocked to learn that privacy really is an afterthought for a lot of bay area residents. US anecdote: a product I worked on had a feature which needs full access to a customer's email account to use. The feature scrapes thei…

I worked on a financial product based on one of Intuit's. I was shocked to realize that this Intuit product was impersonating people (using their username and password) to log on to their bank accounts and download all transactions - which our product was then analyzing. I was sure nobody would allow that; who will give a third-party their bank username and password? I was extremely surprised to find out that the ans…

cough Mint

Re: Australian welfare recipient’s data released to counter public criticism

#15

Post by ourmandave »

mdpopescu wrote: post #12
josephg wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm an Australian who lived a couple of years in the Bay Area. The views people hold toward privacy was one of the most surprising cultural differences between our countries. As an outsider I was shocked to learn that privacy really is an afterthought for a lot of bay area residents. US anecdote: a product I worked on had a feature which needs full access to a customer's email account to use. The feature scrapes thei…

I worked on a financial product based on one of Intuit's. I was shocked to realize that this Intuit product was impersonating people (using their username and password) to log on to their bank accounts and download all transactions - which our product was then analyzing. I was sure nobody would allow that; who will give a third-party their bank username and password? I was extremely surprised to find out that the ans…

I wonder if people know how much their data is being accessed by 3rd parties? Maybe it starts with Intuit getting permission for something convenient and a few unread, auto opt-in "change of service agreements" later, they can share it with everyone.

Re: Australian welfare recipient’s data released to counter public criticism

#16

Post by yummyfajitas »

In the event that this release was illegal, I really do feel for the people at the agency. Someone made public false allegations about them and they are legally forbidden from proving that person wrong. It's a tough position to be in.

I don't have a good solution to this, but I do think that there should be a legal way to prove a person is lying if they directly make accusations about you. After all, they are the one who made the situation public, not you.

Re: Australian welfare recipient’s data released to counter public criticism

#17

Post by feld »

josephg wrote: post #9
cyberferret wrote: post #7

No doubting the veracity of this occurrence, but it is baffling that it happened nonetheless - federal government departments here (Australia) are usually cautious to a paranoid level when it comes to people even looking at information. I remember cases when curious internal staff members at the tax and social security offices being sacked on the spot for merely doing searches on celebrity names without due reason. B…

I'm an Australian who lived a couple of years in the Bay Area. The views people hold toward privacy was one of the most surprising cultural differences between our countries. As an outsider I was shocked to learn that privacy really is an afterthought for a lot of bay area residents. US anecdote: a product I worked on had a feature which needs full access to a customer's email account to use. The feature scrapes thei…

Fastmail is Australian. If you have a support issue and need to have an email examined they refuse to help unless you create a top level folder called "forwebmaster" and put the email there.

The first time I had to do this it solidified my trust in their services.

Re: Australian welfare recipient’s data released to counter public criticism

#18

Post by jbapple »

yummyfajitas wrote: post #16

In the event that this release was illegal, I really do feel for the people at the agency. Someone made public false allegations about them and they are legally forbidden from proving that person wrong. It's a tough position to be in. I don't have a good solution to this, but I do think that there should be a legal way to prove a person is lying if they directly make accusations about you. After all, they are the one…

> there should be a legal way to prove a person is lying if they directly make accusations about you.

"about you"? Her article did not name or provide identifying information about any individual employee of Centrelink.

Re: Australian welfare recipient’s data released to counter public criticism

#19

Post by prawn »

yummyfajitas wrote: post #16

In the event that this release was illegal, I really do feel for the people at the agency. Someone made public false allegations about them and they are legally forbidden from proving that person wrong. It's a tough position to be in. I don't have a good solution to this, but I do think that there should be a legal way to prove a person is lying if they directly make accusations about you. After all, they are the one…

Is there something wrong with the agency making a public statement refuting the allegations, citing the information they have (but without specifics for privacy reasons)? Surely that helps them without their having handed over information?

Re: Australian welfare recipient’s data released to counter public criticism

#20

Post by prawn »

jbapple wrote: post #18
yummyfajitas wrote: post #16

In the event that this release was illegal, I really do feel for the people at the agency. Someone made public false allegations about them and they are legally forbidden from proving that person wrong. It's a tough position to be in. I don't have a good solution to this, but I do think that there should be a legal way to prove a person is lying if they directly make accusations about you. After all, they are the one…

> there should be a legal way to prove a person is lying if they directly make accusations about you. "about you "? Her article did not name or provide identifying information about any individual employee of Centrelink.

Doesn't Australian defamation law only apply to organisations below a certain size? (15 employees or FTE - something like that.)
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