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DHH answers: What makes Rails a framework worth learning in 2017?

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Re: DHH answers: What makes Rails a framework worth learning in 2017?

#11

Post by dceddia »

currywurst wrote: post #5

I admire the way DHH writes .. confident and persuasive. However, I'd just like to point out that in the same span of time JavaEE has undergone significant simplification (omakase API standards, anyone ;)) and if you check out the work of Adam Bien, you'll quickly find old myths of bloated memory consumption and fiddly XML configuration debunked. Java is also lucky to have a parallel full-featured stack in the Spring…

I took his comment about "very little activity in integrated solutions" to mean "[in the JavaScript world]" but maybe that's not what he meant.

I do think that's pretty true of the JS ecosystem though. There are things like Sails, but most of the "new" stuff that comes out is build systems, tools, small libraries, and view libraries.

As to why... it's anyone's guess.

My guess is that making a full-stack opinionated framework like Rails is a big undertaking, and most people are focused on what they see as "quick wins" -- solutions to the obvious surface-level pains like "npm is slow" and "making forms with React is hard" that can gain traction quickly and rise to stardom on Github.

Maybe this is cynical to mention, but fame and recognition (and maybe interesting job offers) seem to be a big driving force behind the constant influx of new and better JS libraries/tools.

Re: DHH answers: What makes Rails a framework worth learning in 2017?

#12

Post by pmontra »

0xsnowcrash wrote: post #6

Rails, as any backend system such as Drupal or Symfony, is inevitably a dead end technology. The web is increasingly moving frontend and the system of 2018 onwards will simply be the M in MVC. Note, I'm not saying Rails is not worth learning. I'm just saying it's now the Cobol of web technology.

I can imagine more and more web apps as frontends to multiple services of other companies, but there is still space for custom backends. I've got a customer that is developing its company around a custom ERP (under development) because he says there is nothing out there that can interface the systems he has to exchange data with. Of course sooner or later somebody will provide those services, using backend technologies.

Re: DHH answers: What makes Rails a framework worth learning in 2017?

#14

Post by pmontra »

newsat13 wrote: post #7

So, I have seen rails code and I did not fall in love with the code. Instead what I saw just black magic and all sorts of conventions. Reminded me of perl. You have to invest a lot of time knowing all the magic stuff.

There isn't much black magic. Most of it is pretty sane naming conventions which could be OK in any sw project, plus database schema autodiscovery. The bonus is increased maintainability.

Re: DHH answers: What makes Rails a framework worth learning in 2017?

#16

Post by vinhboy »

> formalizing conventions, eliminating valueless choices, and offering a full-stack framework that provides great defaults for anyone who wants to create a complete application

Maybe I've drank the kool-aid too much, but I agree with this whole-heartedly.

It reminds me of when I want to paint a room. I can go to Home Depot and spend an hour picking out all the tools I need, or I can buy one of those pre-packed toolkit and get to the actual painting immediately.

Rails + Heroku = My product will be ready to demo by end of the week.

Obviously this mentality only applies to people like me who wants to get things done quickly. People who value craftsmanship and specificity should do what pleases them. (That's not to say you can't do quality work with pre-packed toolkits)

Re: DHH answers: What makes Rails a framework worth learning in 2017?

#18

Post by BOBOTWINSTON »

pyrophane wrote: post #9
0xsnowcrash wrote: post #6

Rails, as any backend system such as Drupal or Symfony, is inevitably a dead end technology. The web is increasingly moving frontend and the system of 2018 onwards will simply be the M in MVC. Note, I'm not saying Rails is not worth learning. I'm just saying it's now the Cobol of web technology.

If I read your comment correctly, I believe you are suggesting that backends will provide APIs, which would leave us with the MC in MVC, the controller is still needed to map data structures to API endpoints. My question to you is this: why do you believe that? I think we have all witnessed a growth in popularity in front-end MVC frameworks, but are they the correct solution to all problems?

Not to mention Rails has an API only generator for new apps now... so this problem is framework destroying 'use case' is solved with a single flag.

Re: DHH answers: What makes Rails a framework worth learning in 2017?

#19

Post by jrs95 »

patsplat wrote: post #17

Each user today commands a personal fleet of many devices. "You get to use Ruby" is a weak justification for a monolithic architecture.

He considers the monolithic architecture to be an advantage: https://m.signalvnoise.com/the-majestic-monolith-29166d02222...

Re: DHH answers: What makes Rails a framework worth learning in 2017?

#20

Post by GavinMcG »

patsplat wrote: post #17

Each user today commands a personal fleet of many devices. "You get to use Ruby" is a weak justification for a monolithic architecture.

Sorry, but I've really got no idea what you're saying here. What's the connection between users having many devices and the monolithic architecture bit?
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