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Google reveals its servers all contain custom security silicon

theregister.co.uk

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Re: Google reveals its servers all contain custom security silicon

#11

Post by pjc50 »

sergiosgc wrote: post #5

This is another signal of an interesting development on the hardware front. What used to be decoupled, with some companies offering hardware, and different companies buying hardware, is now coupled and hidden within these mega-companies (Google, Amazon, FB). Google is big enough to develop a trusted hardware solution for internal use only, it has no financial need to sell it. Worse, due to competitiveness in the clou…

> immense positive benefit of moving all capex to opex

Hmm. Is that really a benefit or Enron-ing yourself? I can see how it allows efficient ramp-up of small companies which can't afford a whole sysadmin for ops, but the big downside is that the return on capital goes to the megacompanies, to whom you are paying rent.

I can sort of see why it's happened, because it's very hard to capture the added value of software by selling it. Especially in this area, the value of software is driven to zero. Whereas restructuring as a service and putting up barriers to entry brings back the margins for the developer.

We almost need an update to Coase's Theory of the Firm to account for the disruptive effects of IP-heavy organisation.

Re: Google reveals its servers all contain custom security silicon

#12

Post by deelowe »

nom wrote: post #8
sergiosgc wrote: post #5

This is another signal of an interesting development on the hardware front. What used to be decoupled, with some companies offering hardware, and different companies buying hardware, is now coupled and hidden within these mega-companies (Google, Amazon, FB). Google is big enough to develop a trusted hardware solution for internal use only, it has no financial need to sell it. Worse, due to competitiveness in the clou…

"We are heading onto a more closed ecosystem than we are used to up until here. " It wouldn't be more open even if they didn't spin their own hardware. You won't ever see it nor have access to it on a low level - it's 'the cloud'. The only thing it tells us is that they have reached a scale where custom hardware makes things cheaper, more reliable and more manageable for them.

Google joined open compute last year.

Re: Google reveals its servers all contain custom security silicon

#13

Post by GFK_of_xmaspast »

sergiosgc wrote: post #5

This is another signal of an interesting development on the hardware front. What used to be decoupled, with some companies offering hardware, and different companies buying hardware, is now coupled and hidden within these mega-companies (Google, Amazon, FB). Google is big enough to develop a trusted hardware solution for internal use only, it has no financial need to sell it. Worse, due to competitiveness in the clou…

So basically what was assumed to be a linear trend is turning out to be a dialectic.

Re: Google reveals its servers all contain custom security silicon

#14

Post by problems »

woliveirajr wrote: post #3

> Disks get the following treatment: > “We enable hardware encryption support in our hard drives and SSDs and meticulously track each drive through its lifecycle. Before a decommissioned encrypted storage device can physically leave our custody, it is cleaned using a multi-step process that includes two independent verifications. Devices that do not pass this wiping procedure are physically destroyed (e.g. shredded)…

If you use on-board crypto on most SSDs, there's a dedicated place for key storage and using the SSD's onboard wipe feature just changes the key and TRIMs the whole drive.

Most of these drives use cryptographic keys even if you don't use a password on the device. Think about it as an SSD manufacturer - what's the easiest way to wipe a drive? To actually go and zero out every cell on the disk or to overwrite a very small cryptographic key with a new one - effectively destroying the data without the need for any other write cycles to occur.

Pretty easy to verify - if you have an SSD with support for this, which most do now.

Re: Google reveals its servers all contain custom security silicon

#15

Post by pm90 »

vgt wrote: post #10
sergiosgc wrote: post #5

This is another signal of an interesting development on the hardware front. What used to be decoupled, with some companies offering hardware, and different companies buying hardware, is now coupled and hidden within these mega-companies (Google, Amazon, FB). Google is big enough to develop a trusted hardware solution for internal use only, it has no financial need to sell it. Worse, due to competitiveness in the clou…

It's a sign of changing times indeed, but for the consumer's benefit. It is absolutely in Google's best interests to externalize security for its customers as a differentiator of Google Cloud. The parent article itself links to the white paper that outlines how this is done for Google Cloud. I understand how one may consider this a "closed ecosystem" from one perspective. However, from a customer point of view any st…

> I understand how one may consider this a "closed ecosystem" from one perspective. However, from a customer point of view any startup or mom-and-pop can leverage these very complex and expensive world-class security developments, whereas in the past this access has been reserved to the very select few that could afford it. When the barrier to entry is lowered and access is commoditized, customer wins.

I don't understand why the customer can't get these benefits AND the ecosystem be open as well.

Re: Google reveals its servers all contain custom security silicon

#16

Post by pm90 »

pjc50 wrote: post #11
sergiosgc wrote: post #5

This is another signal of an interesting development on the hardware front. What used to be decoupled, with some companies offering hardware, and different companies buying hardware, is now coupled and hidden within these mega-companies (Google, Amazon, FB). Google is big enough to develop a trusted hardware solution for internal use only, it has no financial need to sell it. Worse, due to competitiveness in the clou…

> immense positive benefit of moving all capex to opex Hmm. Is that really a benefit or Enron-ing yourself? I can see how it allows efficient ramp-up of small companies which can't afford a whole sysadmin for ops, but the big downside is that the return on capital goes to the megacompanies, to whom you are paying rent. I can sort of see why it's happened, because it's very hard to capture the added value of software…

It reduces the resources needed to bootstrap your own company. Of course once it reaches a certain size, it makes it more cost effective to host your resources internally. There are also many organizations who do not want to deal with a whole division dedicated to maintaining a reliable, distributed, secure computer network for their employees and would be more willing to pay for the cloud rather than the extra people required to maintain the in-house solution.

Re: Google reveals its servers all contain custom security silicon

#17

Post by sergiosgc »

nom wrote: post #8
sergiosgc wrote: post #5

This is another signal of an interesting development on the hardware front. What used to be decoupled, with some companies offering hardware, and different companies buying hardware, is now coupled and hidden within these mega-companies (Google, Amazon, FB). Google is big enough to develop a trusted hardware solution for internal use only, it has no financial need to sell it. Worse, due to competitiveness in the clou…

"We are heading onto a more closed ecosystem than we are used to up until here. " It wouldn't be more open even if they didn't spin their own hardware. You won't ever see it nor have access to it on a low level - it's 'the cloud'. The only thing it tells us is that they have reached a scale where custom hardware makes things cheaper, more reliable and more manageable for them.

> It wouldn't be more open even if they didn't spin their own hardware.

Of course. If the alternative is non-development, we are better off. However, my text states that the alternative is de-coupling: One company develops and markets the innovative hardware solution, other companies build services on top of that solution. This would be more open, it would present a more liquid market.

Re: Google reveals its servers all contain custom security silicon

#18

Post by sergiosgc »

vgt wrote: post #10
sergiosgc wrote: post #5

This is another signal of an interesting development on the hardware front. What used to be decoupled, with some companies offering hardware, and different companies buying hardware, is now coupled and hidden within these mega-companies (Google, Amazon, FB). Google is big enough to develop a trusted hardware solution for internal use only, it has no financial need to sell it. Worse, due to competitiveness in the clou…

It's a sign of changing times indeed, but for the consumer's benefit. It is absolutely in Google's best interests to externalize security for its customers as a differentiator of Google Cloud. The parent article itself links to the white paper that outlines how this is done for Google Cloud. I understand how one may consider this a "closed ecosystem" from one perspective. However, from a customer point of view any st…

> However, from a customer point of view any startup or mom-and-pop can leverage these very complex and expensive world-class security developments, whereas in the past this access has been reserved to the very select few that could afford it.

I don't expect startups or mom-and-pop's to build internal clouds. I do expect medium to large companies to do so. The current market turns innovations such as these into competitive advantages of Google, instead of directly exposing the innovation to the market and allowing incorporation of its advantage into anyone's product. It's a less liquid market. Either you buy all of Google's solution as a package, or you buy none. You can't pick, sort and mash a solution of your own from disparate parts.

Note that Google here is just an example. All companies of similar size in IT are doing the same, and strategically it is the correct option (for them). I'm just stating that the overall result is sub-optimal through a collusion of disparate factors.

Re: Google reveals its servers all contain custom security silicon

#19

Post by sergiosgc »

_yosefk wrote: post #9
sergiosgc wrote: post #5

This is another signal of an interesting development on the hardware front. What used to be decoupled, with some companies offering hardware, and different companies buying hardware, is now coupled and hidden within these mega-companies (Google, Amazon, FB). Google is big enough to develop a trusted hardware solution for internal use only, it has no financial need to sell it. Worse, due to competitiveness in the clou…

It's not the cloud - it's the sad downside of the democratization of hardware design, as in fabs like TSMC and IP companies like ARM making it relatively cheap to make your own chips with competitive functionality in a wide range of areas. There's a lot of custom hardware outside the cloud, say in embedded electronics, that's just as closed as the stuff in server farms - closed specs and no way to program the thing,…

Very much true. I don't think the two reasons are exclusive; it is probably a factor mix. Lowered development costs, economies of scale, need for competitive edge in a market that slopes into commoditization.

Re: Google reveals its servers all contain custom security silicon

#20

Post by ust »

_yosefk wrote: post #9
sergiosgc wrote: post #5

This is another signal of an interesting development on the hardware front. What used to be decoupled, with some companies offering hardware, and different companies buying hardware, is now coupled and hidden within these mega-companies (Google, Amazon, FB). Google is big enough to develop a trusted hardware solution for internal use only, it has no financial need to sell it. Worse, due to competitiveness in the clou…

It's not the cloud - it's the sad downside of the democratization of hardware design, as in fabs like TSMC and IP companies like ARM making it relatively cheap to make your own chips with competitive functionality in a wide range of areas. There's a lot of custom hardware outside the cloud, say in embedded electronics, that's just as closed as the stuff in server farms - closed specs and no way to program the thing,…

It seems a bit counterintuitive that open hardware results in less choice, so I disagree. I think that hardware is getting more and more open, also drivers for it. With FPGAs it is (relatively) straightforward for one to create it's own crypto processor and integrate it in the system. Also PCBs are getting easier and cheaper to make. I hope that also there will be some open PCB designs that incorporate some kind of crypto chips and functionalities outside of CPUs, so everyone can start creating their own servers, if desired.

Didn't also Facebook started some open server hardware initiative? I don't remember what happened with that...

I do agree that the current status is not great, and that we could all benefit from more open hardware design. I think that it would also benefit large companies as well.

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