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Future Economy (2010) [video]

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Re: Future Economy (2010) [video]

#11

Post by hacker_9 »

aiNohY6g wrote: post #7
hacker_9 wrote: post #2

I wish. The truth is the whole world is run on money, meaning the millionaires and billionaires are the ones in charge. It absolutely doesn't have to be this way; we already produce so much food no one need starve. But greed runs deep within humanity, preventing this sort of change from ever happening.

You can make this change happen in your own life. Perhaps not completely, but probably significantly enough to make a big difference. Truth is: the whole world is run on money.... because we're all looking for money. Change your mind, use all the margin you have, promote humanity, and your world starts to change.

This isn't a small scale change, everyone has to be on board for it to work.

Re: Future Economy (2010) [video]

#12

Post by aiNohY6g »

flareback wrote: post #4

It's a nice theory but doesn't solve the problem of supply and demand. If there are 7 billion people on earth that all want a widget, how does this economic philosophy handle the fact that the manufacturing capability can only produce enough widgets for 1 billion people. Who decides which billion people get the widget?

Even if you optimize the supply/demand problem, you just can't rule a finite world with infinite desires. At some point, there are things you need to give up. The question is: which things, and when?

Re: Future Economy (2010) [video]

#14

Post by hacker_9 »

aiNohY6g wrote: post #3

(haven't watched it yet) Why should we wait for the future to improve ourselves and humanity? IMHO we should start right now. We should even have started a long time ago.

Mainly because the ones in power want to stay in power, and actively stop change. We are safer than ever, yet according to the media we are super lucky to not be killed by a terrorist every second of the day.

Re: Future Economy (2010) [video]

#15

Post by aiNohY6g »

hacker_9 wrote: post #11
aiNohY6g wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can make this change happen in your own life. Perhaps not completely, but probably significantly enough to make a big difference. Truth is: the whole world is run on money.... because we're all looking for money. Change your mind, use all the margin you have, promote humanity, and your world starts to change.

This isn't a small scale change, everyone has to be on board for it to work.

A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step. It can be yours.

Re: Future Economy (2010) [video]

#16

Post by rublev »

ZenoArrow wrote: post #10
blakeyrat wrote: post #6

Ok; I want to improve myself by moving into a big house on the shore of Lake Washington. Oh. It takes money to do that? Well shoot. EDIT: to actually respond to the video clip, it's kind of surprising how interesting Star Trek got when they threw out some of Roddenberry's ideas during the Deep Space 9 era. The Starfleet people co-existed with the Ferengi and Bajorans who didn't have post-scarcity economies. The Bajor…

How does moving to a big house improve you?

How doesn't it? I'm living in an apartment right now bordering a psycho neighbour and it's mentally ruining me. I can only dream of having my own quiet space again. Simply having the mental freedom to think about what you want, not 'juggling' thoughts about managing your lifestyle around other peoples lives.

If you are well slept and content, then arguably everything you undertake will be the 'improved' version.

Re: Future Economy (2010) [video]

#17

Post by aiNohY6g »

hacker_9 wrote: post #14
aiNohY6g wrote: post #3

(haven't watched it yet) Why should we wait for the future to improve ourselves and humanity? IMHO we should start right now. We should even have started a long time ago.

Mainly because the ones in power want to stay in power, and actively stop change. We are safer than ever, yet according to the media we are super lucky to not be killed by a terrorist every second of the day.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discourse_on_Voluntary_Servitu...

The essay argues that any tyrant remains in power until his subjects grant him that, therefore delegitimizing every form of power. The original freedom of men would be indeed abandoned by society which, once corrupted by the habit, would have preferred the servitude of the courtier to the freedom of the free man, who refuses to be submissive and to obey.

Re: Future Economy (2010) [video]

#18

Post by flareback »

hacker_9 wrote: post #9
flareback wrote: post #4

It's a nice theory but doesn't solve the problem of supply and demand. If there are 7 billion people on earth that all want a widget, how does this economic philosophy handle the fact that the manufacturing capability can only produce enough widgets for 1 billion people. Who decides which billion people get the widget?

I would think that in such a society, people would upload blueprints for how to create things, which you could then send to your local manufacturing plant to get built. Some sort of advanced 3d printer could even see these sorts of things widespread. Additionally it would be 100% recyclable, with the idea that you would 'give back to the earth' when you were done with it (materialism would be a thing of the past).

It doesn't matter how it gets created if there is only the manufacturing capability to produce x amount yet more than x number of people want it? Maybe there isn't the raw materials to produce it, perhaps it takes too long to produce. Maybe it's that we all want our own spaceship and don't want to be under the command of Captain Picard. Maybe it's something even more limited like a house exactly on the north pole. Without money, who decides who gets to live exactly on the north pole?

Re: Future Economy (2010) [video]

#19

Post by flareback »

ZenoArrow wrote: post #8
flareback wrote: post #4

It's a nice theory but doesn't solve the problem of supply and demand. If there are 7 billion people on earth that all want a widget, how does this economic philosophy handle the fact that the manufacturing capability can only produce enough widgets for 1 billion people. Who decides which billion people get the widget?

Do they have to own said widget, or do they merely require use of said widget?

irrelevant. Only 1 billion people can have it and 7 billion want it.

Re: Future Economy (2010) [video]

#20

Post by canadian_voter »

flareback wrote: post #4

It's a nice theory but doesn't solve the problem of supply and demand. If there are 7 billion people on earth that all want a widget, how does this economic philosophy handle the fact that the manufacturing capability can only produce enough widgets for 1 billion people. Who decides which billion people get the widget?

Well, for a start, it's a post-scarcity society that has the capacity to produce 7 billion widgets if necessary. So that gets you around a lot of problems.

You'll notice that the crew quarters in the show are decorated in a minimalist style. The only objects people keep are the ones that are important to them. Tools, games, gifts can be conjured as needed and recycled when you're done with them.

Scarce resources do exist, however, especially on a starship: crew quarters are probably not all of the same size, for example. Some people might have to walk a little further to the turbolift (elevator). These sorts of resource allocation problems are likely solved by either a lottery method or based on need. For example, if the Captain gets bigger quarters, it's not because she's the captain, it's because she might need the space to host visiting delegates, etc.

Although I suppose there are still some material inequalities based on rank. For example, ensigns get a single rank pip, while a captain gets four.

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