Live data from Hacker News

I had a health crisis in France

latimes.com

11–20 of 312 posts

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#11
Real problem in US with health (and education...) is that cost has skyrocketed out of control. How much is hearth bypass ? $30k? Other countries do that for $4k with similar quality and better post-op care.

Public health care will just transfer more money from poor to corporations (like with education). You need to fix the leaks first, for example sponsor medical tourism to other countries, etc...

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#12
post #6

> My individual burden, however, is far more reasonable than > an American might assume. I pay an annual income tax of > about 23%. How comes this number is that low? Tax revenue in France account for about 48% of the country's GDP[1]. I'm living in Belgium, and my payroll tax is already higher than these 23%. -- [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_reven...

It's probably tiered, like in many other EU countries. In UK for example you don't pay any tax on the first 10k earned, then 20% on anything between 10k and 40k, and then 40% on anything above 40k. I think there's a tier above it as well, but I'm not 100% sure. I know France has more tiers and they are more aggressive(80% being the highest I think?)

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#13
Does France really have that low tax rate? Usually it's not only income tax people are paying over here and once Americans laern the total % of your money regular Joe pays for the government they are in shock, since they are not used to having so little money being left on the table.

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#14
post #6

> My individual burden, however, is far more reasonable than > an American might assume. I pay an annual income tax of > about 23%. How comes this number is that low? Tax revenue in France account for about 48% of the country's GDP[1]. I'm living in Belgium, and my payroll tax is already higher than these 23%. -- [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_reven...

In France you pay 0 % taxes for the first 9.700 € of income, then 14 % for everything up to 26.791 €, then 30 % for everything up to 71.826 €, then 41 % for everything up to 152.108 € and 45 % for everything beyond that [1]. Hence 23 % effective tax rate sounds reasonable for an average income of around 50.000 €. The tax system in many European countries is similar btw, as is the health system.

[1] https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bar%C3%A8mes_de_l'imp%C3%B4t_s...

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#15
post #6

> My individual burden, however, is far more reasonable than > an American might assume. I pay an annual income tax of > about 23%. How comes this number is that low? Tax revenue in France account for about 48% of the country's GDP[1]. I'm living in Belgium, and my payroll tax is already higher than these 23%. -- [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_reven...

>How comes this number is that low?

A low income person in the US can pay effectively 0%. Your percentage in most countries depends heavily on how much you make.

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#16

The US spends more per capita on health care than other OECD countries, even ones with universal public health care: http://kff.org/health-costs/issue-brief/snapshots-health-car... And yet the US has lower life expectancy than those countries: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_life_expe...

Infant mortality is also 75% higher in the US compared to France: https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/...

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#17
post #6

> My individual burden, however, is far more reasonable than > an American might assume. I pay an annual income tax of > about 23%. How comes this number is that low? Tax revenue in France account for about 48% of the country's GDP[1]. I'm living in Belgium, and my payroll tax is already higher than these 23%. -- [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_reven...

I wondered about that as well, I pay like 40%...

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#18

But that's socialism, and the USA will never tolerate socialism.

But only if it's called socialism. If it can be called something else, then it will be accepted. In my experience, US citizens (not all, obviously; I'm massively generalising) have been conditioned to be against things labelled socialism, but the level of economic and political knowledge amongst the general public is such that if you don't call something socialism, it is judged on its own merits without people realis…

Opponents will hang that label on it, and then it doesn't matter whether or not the general populace would recognise it.

It's interesting that my comment is somehow controversial, because it's been down to -2, is now back to -1. I wonder whether they are objecting to my calling "universal healthcare funded by taxes on the general populace" socialism, or whether they are objecting to the claim that the USA populace would ever accept a socialist policy.

Indeed, while I've been editing this comment it's gone back down to -2. Interesting to watch, and I really do wonder what it is that's provoking people into downvoting it.

... and now back to -1. Fascinating!

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#20
post #11

Real problem in US with health (and education...) is that cost has skyrocketed out of control. How much is hearth bypass ? $30k? Other countries do that for $4k with similar quality and better post-op care. Public health care will just transfer more money from poor to corporations (like with education). You need to fix the leaks first, for example sponsor medical tourism to other countries, etc...

I don't think "the cost skyrocketed out of control". The cost is simply reflective of the leverage the health care provider and all the middle men in between hold against the patient.

It's just that in other countries you have the government setting up a monopsony and dictating costs and salaries.

I don't see how charging $30k for a heart bypass is unreasonable for somebody making $50k/year.

Post reply on HN