I think it is more of a traditional security approach of "pairing hardware with hardware" and a case of "not fixing what is not broken" instead of making consumers suffer. It just works.
Ask HN: Why are SIM cards still a thing?
11–20 of 191 posts
Re: Ask HN: Why are SIM cards still a thing?
#12Locking devices to networks (as US telcos do) makes it harder to switch providers than swapping a $5 SIM.
Same with switching devices and keeping a provider. Using a SIM, takes about a minute. Not using a SIM? Call them or whatever, maybe pay a fee.
Re: Ask HN: Why are SIM cards still a thing?
#13> Feels like this is probably the result of telco networks wanting as much friction as possible to change providers, but is there something more to it?
In 3rd world countries, people regularly swithch their SIMs as they travel across borders because no one has cross-country access. Taking a SIM out only uses up a minute of your time, and standizing on a hardwardware dongle like that is great because if company A goes out of business, you just grab a new SIM and stick it in.
It's a bit harder in the US, where phones are locked to their providers, and you need IDs to buy SIMs but that's really all just a regulation issue, not a technical one.
Re: Ask HN: Why are SIM cards still a thing?
#14Yes, security and flexibility. 1) Security: telco laws these days often require registration of accounts to your personal ID (i.e. no anonymous usage any more). How would a pure soft-SIM be able to fetch the data from the network? 2) Flexibility: SIM is pretty much standardized. This means a newcomer MVNO just has to issue SIM cards and the customer can use any kind of phone (or other interface, like a modem, a 2G/3G…
Wouldn't e.g. a username and password accomplish the same thing as what you're describing?
Re: Ask HN: Why are SIM cards still a thing?
#15There are some solutions out that are in software that are "eSIM" which allow devices to switch carriers through an OTA update. Also see a company called SIMless. There's a lot of market momentum around SIM cards and it keeps a telco's offering really sticky. It is more effort for people to swap hardware instead of software.
> There's a lot of market momentum around SIM cards and it keeps a telco's offering really sticky. It is more effort for people to swap hardware instead of software.
I'd love to see evidence of this. Switching SIMs is something non-technical users do regularly.
Re: Ask HN: Why are SIM cards still a thing?
#16Yes, security and flexibility. 1) Security: telco laws these days often require registration of accounts to your personal ID (i.e. no anonymous usage any more). How would a pure soft-SIM be able to fetch the data from the network? 2) Flexibility: SIM is pretty much standardized. This means a newcomer MVNO just has to issue SIM cards and the customer can use any kind of phone (or other interface, like a modem, a 2G/3G…
Wouldn't e.g. a username and password accomplish the same thing as what you're describing?
Now any hacker that finds a flaw in a mobile OS will be able to impersonate you with another phone. For what gain?
Re: Ask HN: Why are SIM cards still a thing?
#17SIM: Subscriber Identity Module almost says it all, on top of that a SIM can store your contacts (up to a certain number).
The SIM is what separates your identity from the hardware of the phone (which has its own identity called 'IMEI').
A 'software solution' would need a carrier, that carrier IS the SIM.
Another nice benefit of having the SIM device is that it makes it much harder to 'clone' a subscriber ID, something that would regularly happen in the days before the SIM card, note that the SIM was a development that came along with GSM, and that GSM was the first mobile phone standard resistant against cloning. It's one part of the 2FA (something that you have) that gives you access to the phone network (the other being the PIN code (something that you know) required to unlock the SIM).
Re: Ask HN: Why are SIM cards still a thing?
#18Because they handle private keys that is soldered to chip and can't be retrieved at all. Before sim cards there was something in the phones that can be easily reprogrammed and you always have to walk to your carrier office to "program" your phone. Swapping of sim cards is much easier.
Usually these unique bits are burned in with fuses as a step in manufacturing in a non reversible process.
Re: Ask HN: Why are SIM cards still a thing?
#19'eSIM' is on the way to replace sim cards. The biggest challenge of 'downloading a sim card' to a secure enclave on a phone is of course security.
The GSMA and members (i.e. telcos) have been working on secure remote provisioning. I think it'll take a while for the technology to make it in to consumer devices, though it's likely to be used in IoT relatively soon.
It takes a long time to spec these things up collaboratively and then even longer for telco's to act on it!
See: http://www.gsma.com/rsp/2016/04/27/esim-opportunity-operator... and http://www.gsma.com/rsp/ (Warning: Lots of marketing BS)
Re: Ask HN: Why are SIM cards still a thing?
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