4chan is running out of money–and Martin Shkreli wants to help out • Hacker News Board

Re: 4chan is running out of money–and Martin Shkreli wants to help out

#11

Post by lovich » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 4:20 PM UTC

M_Grey wrote: post #8

bbctol wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's more likely that without 4chan, the general trolling and immaturity may leak onto the rest of the internet, and the really intense racism/misogyny/conspiratorial weirdness will go further underground and anonymous. Whether this would be a good thing is debatable; I liked that 4chan was open enough anyone could check on it and see which way the undercurrents of the internet were heading, but it probably w…

4Chan isn't a prison, it's an incubator. See: Pepe.

Pepe is used for everything. You can take any symbol and make it horrible if you start adding nazi paraphernalia to it. 4Chan happens to add that sort of stuff to everything

Re: 4chan is running out of money–and Martin Shkreli wants to help out

#12

Post by ue_ » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 4:20 PM UTC

bbctol wrote: post #6

unethical_ban wrote: post #3

I recall several netizens posting concern about the buyer of 4chan, how he ran some other Japanese sites into the ground. Now on /. there is someone claiming the new owner turned ads down and tried to promote 4chan passes, which now don't work. Another person points out that even if you hate 4chan (or especially if you do), it'd be better left intact to contain the culture that foments there. Otherwise we might see /…

I think it's more likely that without 4chan, the general trolling and immaturity may leak onto the rest of the internet, and the really intense racism/misogyny/conspiratorial weirdness will go further underground and anonymous. Whether this would be a good thing is debatable; I liked that 4chan was open enough anyone could check on it and see which way the undercurrents of the internet were heading, but it probably w…

The idea that 4chan (and similar imageboard forums) are all racist is such a tiring and false trope. It's easy to get that impression, but there are jokes and actual racism and people who are indifferent. Part of the effect is that some users there have managed to trick most people into thinking 4chan is some scary, racist hellhole that no civilised, "mature" person would ever go to.

Rather, I find that 4chan and similar places (8chan etc.) dependent of the board, are very good sources for unrestricted discussion. You don't get your post hidden or deleted people it's abhorrent or people disagree with it. You don't get reported or "flagged" because you used some profanity. People don't coast along on high score points. If you screw up you can start again, because you're anonymous anyway, and nobody will care. Nobody will know.

If you don't believe what I'm saying, I'd suggest taking a deeper look at imageboard culture. I've helped people with programming problems and I've been helped by others. I've learned new things and commented on the news. I got into new hobbies. I discovered plenty of music. I discuss my religion; all on 4chan and 8chan.

And before you may be influenced to think I must be a racist or misogynist or "immature" etc. or have such tendencies by virtue of being a user, I will say that I'm a hard-left supporter of equality and rights for all. And I came to that status via debate and learning on the "worst" parts of 4chan.

Take from that what you will, but please do not spread misinformation or unknowingly (if it is unknowingly) perpetuate this culture of fear for 4chan. It's tiring and is one of the causes for 4chan's decline - people are turned away without having ever used the website.

Re: 4chan is running out of money–and Martin Shkreli wants to help out

#13

Post by KON_Air » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 4:32 PM UTC

lovich wrote: post #11

M_Grey wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

4Chan isn't a prison, it's an incubator. See: Pepe.

Pepe is used for everything. You can take any symbol and make it horrible if you start adding nazi paraphernalia to it. 4Chan happens to add that sort of stuff to everything

It even it has its own bronze age style end of days cult which promotes Trump for a more through destruction of the world. Got to admire how they managed to sell their stuff to early Trump shills and play internet frog illuminati.

Re: 4chan is running out of money–and Martin Shkreli wants to help out

#14

Post by bbctol » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 4:38 PM UTC

ue_ wrote: post #12

bbctol wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's more likely that without 4chan, the general trolling and immaturity may leak onto the rest of the internet, and the really intense racism/misogyny/conspiratorial weirdness will go further underground and anonymous. Whether this would be a good thing is debatable; I liked that 4chan was open enough anyone could check on it and see which way the undercurrents of the internet were heading, but it probably w…

The idea that 4chan (and similar imageboard forums) are all racist is such a tiring and false trope. It's easy to get that impression, but there are jokes and actual racism and people who are indifferent. Part of the effect is that some users there have managed to trick most people into thinking 4chan is some scary, racist hellhole that no civilised, "mature" person would ever go to. Rather, I find that 4chan and sim…

I am extremely familiar with imageboard culture, and have spent a lot of time on anonymous boards. 4chan is not "all racist." 4chan also has a lot of organized and motivated racists, which have had a particularly negative effect on its culture. The general white supremacist internet centered around Stormfront before the term "alt-right" gained any traction was openly organizing and recruiting through 4chan, and to act as if racism hasn't been a core aspect of 4chan's community since the advent of /pol/ indicates a lack of experience with the board. Let me reiterate exactly what I said: the top poster indicated that the negative aspects of 4chan would seep into the rest of the internet, and I expected that instead, the lighter negative aspects, of immaturity and trolling, would spread to the rest of the internet, while the fomenting of racism, misogyny, and overall reactionary rebellion would go deeper underground.

Re: 4chan is running out of money–and Martin Shkreli wants to help out

#15

Post by gnarbarian » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 4:41 PM UTC

I love 4chan. It's a bastion of raw unmitigated free speech and anonymity. Because of this, people naturally use it to say things they can't normally in public or with a account that might be linked back to their real name.

There are no points, only replies. Unpopular opinions aren't hidden. Popular opinions are boring and those threads disappear from a lack of replies. The most provocative threads are the ones which thrive. This is the exact opposite of voting sites like hacker news and Reddit.

We need a place like this to exist where people aren't saddled with long term consequences for making their real opinions known. Users on 4chan are rewarded with replies for thinking outside of the box and breaking rank.

Losing it would be a terrible loss for discourse. Sure there are lots of trolls there. Yes there is lots of racism and offensive content and gore. If you dont like that sort of thing you are free to not go there. But there must be a place for people to hash these ideas out and get unpopular opinions off their chest.

Convenient anonymity on the Internet is dying, and if it does ultimately go so will freedom of speech. Because nobody will be free to speak their mind when a deviant or unpopular opinion may incur the wrath of a targeted campaign against them to destroy their professional and private life at any point in the future. Especially when those opinions which were once common are now out of style. (See Brandon Eich or Palmer Luckey)

The lack of rules and consequences is precisely the reason 4chan has always been a creative powerhouse where trends and content are born at a rate that is unmatched elsewhere. Some of the funniest things I've read have come from the unrestrained banter between people from different countries on the /int/ (international) board.

Despite all this, it's always been difficult to keep that place above water. They need a sort of Reddit gold type epiphany.

Re: 4chan is running out of money–and Martin Shkreli wants to help out

#16

Post by Esperaux » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 4:49 PM UTC

denom wrote: post #2

I guess they deserve each other?

Maybe /pol deserves him but quite a few boards on 4chan where actually pretty accepting and friendly, particularly /I.

Re: 4chan is running out of money–and Martin Shkreli wants to help out

#17

Post by M_Grey » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 5:00 PM UTC

lovich wrote: post #11

M_Grey wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

4Chan isn't a prison, it's an incubator. See: Pepe.

Pepe is used for everything. You can take any symbol and make it horrible if you start adding nazi paraphernalia to it. 4Chan happens to add that sort of stuff to everything

Sure you say that, but try wearing a big swastika around and explaining its history.

Re: 4chan is running out of money–and Martin Shkreli wants to help out

#18

Post by Raphmedia » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 5:10 PM UTC

gnarbarian wrote: post #15

I love 4chan. It's a bastion of raw unmitigated free speech and anonymity. Because of this, people naturally use it to say things they can't normally in public or with a account that might be linked back to their real name. There are no points, only replies. Unpopular opinions aren't hidden. Popular opinions are boring and those threads disappear from a lack of replies. The most provocative threads are the ones which…

> They need a sort of Reddit gold type epiphany.

Can't you already pay for a 4chan premium account that allows you to... I can't remember, post more, ignore the captcha, etc?

Re: 4chan is running out of money–and Martin Shkreli wants to help out

#19

Post by gnarbarian » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 5:14 PM UTC

Raphmedia wrote: post #18

gnarbarian wrote: post #15

I love 4chan. It's a bastion of raw unmitigated free speech and anonymity. Because of this, people naturally use it to say things they can't normally in public or with a account that might be linked back to their real name. There are no points, only replies. Unpopular opinions aren't hidden. Popular opinions are boring and those threads disappear from a lack of replies. The most provocative threads are the ones which…

> They need a sort of Reddit gold type epiphany. Can't you already pay for a 4chan premium account that allows you to... I can't remember, post more, ignore the captcha, etc?

You can't buy it for someone else though. That was the key to the Reddit gold success.

Re: 4chan is running out of money–and Martin Shkreli wants to help out

#20

Post by cholantesh » Tue, Oct 04, 2016, 5:29 PM UTC

unethical_ban wrote: post #3

I recall several netizens posting concern about the buyer of 4chan, how he ran some other Japanese sites into the ground. Now on /. there is someone claiming the new owner turned ads down and tried to promote 4chan passes, which now don't work. Another person points out that even if you hate 4chan (or especially if you do), it'd be better left intact to contain the culture that foments there. Otherwise we might see /…

>Another person points out that even if you hate 4chan (or especially if you do), it'd be better left intact to contain the culture that foments there. Otherwise we might see /r/The_Donald style posts all over the internet.

I used to believe this pretty strongly, but lately...I'm already seeing /pol/ style posts all over the internet, despite its existence, so I'm starting to doubt the 'containment board' thesis is valid.