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More of Kremlin’s Opponents Are Ending Up Dead

nytimes.com

11–20 of 40 posts

Re: More of Kremlin’s Opponents Are Ending Up Dead

#11
While I have no doubt that Russia, like the USA, carries out targeted assassinations, perhaps the NYT should do another piece on some of the suspected victims of a recent US administration.

An article about Paul David Wellstone will be an engaging read.

Re: More of Kremlin’s Opponents Are Ending Up Dead

#15
> poisonings leave little doubt of the state’s involvement — which may be precisely the point.

Exactly. That was the point of using Po-210 for Litvinenko. The goal was to leave no possible doubt who killed him and for what. It was a warning to all future defectors.

So yes, nobody is safe even outside Russia.

Funny enough during Soviet times US seems to have been considered off-limits for targeted assassinations. But recently there have been two cases (Lesin and Poteyev) mentioned that are a bit suspicious.

Wonder if we'd feel a tiny bit like people where targeted drones attack happen feel. It is abstract when it happens 1000s of miles aways. It is different when it happens in your backyard.

> Other countries, notably Israel and the United States, pursue targeted killings, but in a strict counter-terrorism context. No other major power employs murder as systematically and ruthlessly as Russia

Like others pointed out. That is a great line. It is great because it embodies so much -- expected criticism, hidden guilt, need to rationalize, ideology (War On Terror excuses things).

It is also interesting that as soon as War On Terror started Putin has quickly jumped on-board and also started to claim what they were doing was "War On Terror" as well.

Besides the obvious moral repercussion here, engaging in torture and targeted drone killings has made the "we are qualitatively better than " a bit of a harder point to make. Even to the level that NYT can't assume it anymore, but rather have to explain it, expecting the obvious criticism.

Re: More of Kremlin’s Opponents Are Ending Up Dead

#16
post #7

The internal story of Russia right now must be a pretty interesting one. The guy who does Caspian Report did a story a couple days ago arguing that Putin's recent aggression, both internally and externally, is a sort of corner he'd backed himself into that he can't get out of to the detriment of the country. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BT4sK36cU3Y

Really? Russia is now having a military base in Iran and Turkey will likely leave NATO and cooperate with Russia. Israel is also no friend of the Obama administration to put it mildly. Oh and we here in the EU are also very happy with the current Western elite (which hopefully will soon be destroyed by a Trump administration) sending us millions of illiterate Arab men. Maybe Obama will negotiate with ISIS to open a m…

> Israel is also no friend of the Obama administration to put it mildly.

Why do you say that? I understand US is sending billions of dollars of military aid. AIPAC is active and lively in the US lobbying scene and so on.

Re: More of Kremlin’s Opponents Are Ending Up Dead

#17
post #16
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? Russia is now having a military base in Iran and Turkey will likely leave NATO and cooperate with Russia. Israel is also no friend of the Obama administration to put it mildly. Oh and we here in the EU are also very happy with the current Western elite (which hopefully will soon be destroyed by a Trump administration) sending us millions of illiterate Arab men. Maybe Obama will negotiate with ISIS to open a m…

> Israel is also no friend of the Obama administration to put it mildly. Why do you say that? I understand US is sending billions of dollars of military aid. AIPAC is active and lively in the US lobbying scene and so on.

For multiple reasons that all weaken Israels position in the region.

1) Removed Libyan dictator Gaddafi who played ball with Western powers and kept illegal migration to the EU at bay. Replaced with ISIS style radicals.

2) Supported removal of Egypt dictator Mubarak who was definitely an ally of the West and Israel. Replaced by Muslim Brotherhood fanatics who are enemies of Israel and the West. When the Egyptian military removed them from power Obama tried to intervene on behalf of the Muslim Brotherhood.

3) Strengthened Irans position in the world by lifting sanctions. If they want nuclear weapons this would be the time. I'm not saying that I would have supported the coup against Mosaddegh or that I would have supported Iraq on invading Iran. But I would make it very hard for a government run by religious fanatics to acquire nuclear weapons.

4) Syria is an enemy of Israel, but they sure as hell do not want fanatics like ISIS roaming free in the region.

5) Wester main stream media is today very critical of Israel, more so in the EU than in the US. Products from Israel must now be labelled in some EU countries to make it easier for consumers to boycott trade. Some EU countries are even discussing sanctions against Israel. But trade with Saudi Arabia is fine.

Re: More of Kremlin’s Opponents Are Ending Up Dead

#18
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Israel is also no friend of the Obama administration to put it mildly. Why do you say that? I understand US is sending billions of dollars of military aid. AIPAC is active and lively in the US lobbying scene and so on.

For multiple reasons that all weaken Israels position in the region. 1) Removed Libyan dictator Gaddafi who played ball with Western powers and kept illegal migration to the EU at bay. Replaced with ISIS style radicals. 2) Supported removal of Egypt dictator Mubarak who was definitely an ally of the West and Israel. Replaced by Muslim Brotherhood fanatics who are enemies of Israel and the West. When the Egyptian mili…

That makes sense. Thanks for explaining.

Re: More of Kremlin’s Opponents Are Ending Up Dead

#19
post #12

ITT: HN currently being brigaded by the alt right. Beware.

To my knowledge HN is a place for open, civilized discussion - it's not a designated left-wing safe space. The presence of people with different opinions to you doesn't make it a "brigade".

Re: More of Kremlin’s Opponents Are Ending Up Dead

#20
post #14

Ooh!! Big Bad Russia! In comparison, free world good good. Edward Snowden, Julian Assange, Chelsea Manning, Michael Hastings, Paul Wellstone, Omar Torrijos, Oscar Romero, Salvador Allende, Mmmm!

Are any of those people in danger of being assassinated by the USA? I think not. Perhaps jailed, yes, but even then there will be a whole raft-load of legal challenges. The difference is that in Russia there is no legal system (at least, not one that you can trust).
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