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Apple launches coding camps for kids in its retail stores

techcrunch.com

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Re: Apple launches coding camps for kids in its retail stores

#11

Post by rm_-rf_slash »

dublinben wrote: post #10
rm_-rf_slash wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's still better than nothing. If Uncle Ben's rice donates its branded rice to victims of a natural disaster - provided the containers say "Uncle Ben's Rice" - would you refuse it for a generic?

If I were a relief agency, and those were the terms of their donation, I would refuse it. If they aren't willing to donate without making it a marketing opportunity, it's not really charity/philanthropy.

Wow. You would rather people starve than look at a logo?

Wow.

Re: Apple launches coding camps for kids in its retail stores

#12

Post by pjmlp »

dublinben wrote: post #3

I don't think it's necessarily fair to call this program "philanthropic." It's teaching kids how to use proprietary and commercial software, like iMovie, iBooks, and Tynker, when completely free alternatives exist like Blender and Scratch. This is essentially building a new generation of future Apple customers.

It is also teaching kids that there are more ways to do low level stuff and cool games than being forced into pure C culture.

Having a new generation being brought up in compiled safe languages like Swift will be a great improvement for the mainstream coding.

Re: Apple launches coding camps for kids in its retail stores

#13

Post by rm_-rf_slash »

pjmlp wrote: post #12
dublinben wrote: post #3

I don't think it's necessarily fair to call this program "philanthropic." It's teaching kids how to use proprietary and commercial software, like iMovie, iBooks, and Tynker, when completely free alternatives exist like Blender and Scratch. This is essentially building a new generation of future Apple customers.

It is also teaching kids that there are more ways to do low level stuff and cool games than being forced into pure C culture. Having a new generation being brought up in compiled safe languages like Swift will be a great improvement for the mainstream coding.

Exactly!

I gave up on programming in high school when my borrowed C++ textbook started getting into memory management and I couldn't stop my head from spinning. I didn't even know simpler languages like Python existed until I started college.

I'm all for learning the hard stuff, but programming is such a different way of thinking from most things that it's hard enough to get beginners into the mindset, let alone be comfortable and confident with the syntax.

Re: Apple launches coding camps for kids in its retail stores

#14

Post by danso »

Ironically, I sometimes fear Apple would be the harbinger of programming's death, what with how much can be done via consumer-friendly app and touch-screens. It didn't help hearing about OSX becoming macOS, which would be well in line with a dystopian future in which the only people who need to know about plaintext and file systems are the full-time Apple programmers.

But this sounds like a great initiative...and also, one that seems to be nearly all upside for Apple. Great PR, good benefit to society, increased buzz at the brick and mortar stores, and the cost of running these camps seem like it would be more than paid for by kids who are not only buying the programmable peripherals (anyone have experience hacking the Sphero?), but Apple products for all of their coding lives.

Re: Apple launches coding camps for kids in its retail stores

#15

Post by michaelvoz »

dublinben wrote: post #10
rm_-rf_slash wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's still better than nothing. If Uncle Ben's rice donates its branded rice to victims of a natural disaster - provided the containers say "Uncle Ben's Rice" - would you refuse it for a generic?

If I were a relief agency, and those were the terms of their donation, I would refuse it. If they aren't willing to donate without making it a marketing opportunity, it's not really charity/philanthropy.

Then I am glad you are not a relief agency...

Re: Apple launches coding camps for kids in its retail stores

#16

Post by JustSomeNobody »

dublinben wrote: post #3

I don't think it's necessarily fair to call this program "philanthropic." It's teaching kids how to use proprietary and commercial software, like iMovie, iBooks, and Tynker, when completely free alternatives exist like Blender and Scratch. This is essentially building a new generation of future Apple customers.

Yeah, it's a shame the skills you get from learning how to program on one platform don't translate to any other platform.

Re: Apple launches coding camps for kids in its retail stores

#17

Post by rm_-rf_slash »

danso wrote: post #14

Ironically, I sometimes fear Apple would be the harbinger of programming's death, what with how much can be done via consumer-friendly app and touch-screens. It didn't help hearing about OSX becoming macOS, which would be well in line with a dystopian future in which the only people who need to know about plaintext and file systems are the full-time Apple programmers. But this sounds like a great initiative...and als…

I think the invention of the GUI killed the dream of mainstream programming.

If computers had to be interacted with in ways that resembled programming - like a UNIX prompt - then people would be more used to the way computers actually work, with functions and parameters instead of icons and settings menus.

I really hope that raspberry PI gets more mainstream appeal as time goes on. I fear the separation between coders and users is creating parallel worlds of echo-chamber wizards and ignorant commoners.

Re: Apple launches coding camps for kids in its retail stores

#18

Post by JustSomeNobody »

goldenkey wrote: post #9

Its a lot different considering that eating Uncle Ben's afro-american rice doesnt indoctrinate someone into a skillset of only eating long grain pilaf rice. Ie a toolset that only works on mac and thus providing future customers, advocates, and users of Apple products. You really should avoid these shit-for-brains analogies on a forum like HN. We are better than that.

Apparently not everyone...

Re: Apple launches coding camps for kids in its retail stores

#19

Post by dijit »

rm_-rf_slash wrote: post #13
pjmlp wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is also teaching kids that there are more ways to do low level stuff and cool games than being forced into pure C culture. Having a new generation being brought up in compiled safe languages like Swift will be a great improvement for the mainstream coding.

Exactly! I gave up on programming in high school when my borrowed C++ textbook started getting into memory management and I couldn't stop my head from spinning. I didn't even know simpler languages like Python existed until I started college. I'm all for learning the hard stuff, but programming is such a different way of thinking from most things that it's hard enough to get beginners into the mindset, let alone be c…

This will sound like one-upmanship and I definitely do not mean it that way.

When I was a kid I wanted to code to be like the cool dudes I heard about on the internet. The only book I could get was a book on COBOL, with a compiler which would only run on DOS.

COBOL is a horrible language and I never learned to code, now I'm 26 and can do the basics with python.. I'm a sysadmin, maybe that would have been different with a language that actually functioned in the modern day (at the time).

I feel somewhat similarly for swift/rust and the younger generation, there is a very high barrier to entry for C/C++, which flavour should you use? C99 or C11, what compiler, and what flags are needed for compiling your flavour?.. how do I google errors "C null dereference" when "C" is short enough a letter to be ignored by most search indexes?

Personally, I see initiatives such as Apples as a good thing and something I wish I'd had as a kid, even if they have a more sordid agenda.. it's not like coding skills and critical/logical thinking are not transferable skills.

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