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Britain is the most corrupt country in the world?

independent.co.uk

11–20 of 173 posts

Re: Britain is the most corrupt country in the world?

#11
post #2

It would be interesting if someone can reinforce this statement from a developer perspective.

What do you mean by a developer perspective?

The corruption described is almost entirely contained within the area of high finance; it's not a very corrupt country from the perspective of the average John Bull. It is however quite deferential, which means that power and prestige let you get away with things.

Re: Britain is the most corrupt country in the world?

#12

The article (and the "Mafia Expert" it's about) are both idiotic. The premise is that because corruption involves money and money involves banks and London has lots of banks, transitively, London is very corrupt. It then tries to equate Mafia violence with financial firms refusing to hire 'whistleblowers', as if having your legs chopped off is in any way comparable to having a career issue. By similar logic, I could…

If you hold a position of trust (elected politician, policeman, bureaucrat, CEO, board member, employee representative, union boss), and you use the powers of that position to further some private interest rather than the interests of those you are set to serve, then you're corrupt. That's more or less Transparency International's definition, and I agree with it.

But banks' trustees aren't the public. It's their depositors, shareholders and customers. And by most accounts, they serve those reasonably well.

So yeah, they could maybe make a case that Britain is the most corrupting country in the world. But that is not the same thing. Compared to other nations, Britain's public trustees probably aren't so bad at serving the interests of the public.

Re: Britain is the most corrupt country in the world?

#14

The article (and the "Mafia Expert" it's about) are both idiotic. The premise is that because corruption involves money and money involves banks and London has lots of banks, transitively, London is very corrupt. It then tries to equate Mafia violence with financial firms refusing to hire 'whistleblowers', as if having your legs chopped off is in any way comparable to having a career issue. By similar logic, I could…

> The premise is that because corruption involves money and money involves banks and London has lots of banks, transitively, London is very corrupt.

The premise was that the banks of London launder huge amounts of drug money... I don't necessarily agree with this article but you're just avoiding the points it makes.

Re: Britain is the most corrupt country in the world?

#15
post #2

It would be interesting if someone can reinforce this statement from a developer perspective.

What does your question mean, exactly? Corruption from a developer perspective? What would that look like?

I was invovled a couple of times in bidding for the government contracts. Do not have proofs, of course, but the entire design of this system was very open for corruption.

Re: Britain is the most corrupt country in the world?

#17

The UK is the second country with the most intermediaries (banks, accountants, lawyers…) listed in the Panama papers. The first one is Hong Kong, a former British colony. "More than half of the companies listed in the leaked Mossack Fonseca documents are registered in the U.K. or its overseas territories [...] If we want to understand modern Britain, we first need to realize that our primary economic function in the…

Tax havens, hmm?

So around the world, basically, the good honest career politicians from Argentina to Zambia are going around to profitable businesses saying "hey, nice business you have there! We'd like to take, say, 50% of your profits, if you don't mind, and spend it on our friends - government contractors, public-sector unions and the like. All the donations to our campaign afterward are purely incidental, I assure you, and none of the subsidies or handouts we'll use your money for are vote-buying schemes, none at all. Thanks for your cooperation."

... and the UK provides places where they don't do that, not on the top-line profit anyway. Sure. I can see how having that would be attractive to both legitimate and illegitimate operators. Its net impact on corruption, though, would be a little tricky to sort out.

(Postscript. As I'm being moderated down without comment, I assume that those doing so are those privileged enough to be in a nice low-corruption Western economy where we have a slightly better grade of politician than, say, Dilma Rousseff and her legislature. So I wish to note that despite cynicism about world governments I retain due respect for anti-corporate sentiment as well...)

Re: Britain is the most corrupt country in the world?

#18
post #11
post #2

It would be interesting if someone can reinforce this statement from a developer perspective.

What do you mean by a developer perspective? The corruption described is almost entirely contained within the area of high finance; it's not a very corrupt country from the perspective of the average John Bull. It is however quite deferential, which means that power and prestige let you get away with things.

Have to add that in truly corrupt societies the degree of power circles corruption is not any lower. It just looks less appalling from corrupt baseline.

Re: Britain is the most corrupt country in the world?

#19

The article (and the "Mafia Expert" it's about) are both idiotic. The premise is that because corruption involves money and money involves banks and London has lots of banks, transitively, London is very corrupt. It then tries to equate Mafia violence with financial firms refusing to hire 'whistleblowers', as if having your legs chopped off is in any way comparable to having a career issue. By similar logic, I could…

> The premise is that because corruption involves money and money involves banks and London has lots of banks, transitively, London is very corrupt.

I thought it was based on the premise that:

    London is the drug money laundering capital
    of the world
and:

    90 per cent of drug cash ends up in 
    the US and Europe via London
and:

    criminal corporate activities within the City of
    London which have dominated the headlines 
    over the past decade
and:

    an alternative metric for financial corruption
    [puts Britain and its dependencies] top of the list
and:

    the four companies in line to buy [from the Government]
    the UK Land Registry [which tracks the (often foreign)
    ownership of UK properties] are all based in or have
    close links to the offshore tax havens of Jersey, 
    Cayman Islands or Delaware
> career issue

AKA:

     powerful financial firms will destroy the lives
     and reputations of whistleblowers [claiming] a
     100% success rate
From the BBC page linked to under 100% success rate:

    The BBC spoke to one such whistleblower who wrote
    to the FSA [UK financial services regulator] on
    numerous occasions with his concerns about 
    behaviour at his then-investment bank.

    The FSA refused to act on the information
    and even requested that the whistleblower 
    never contact them again.
If the British Prime Minister is happy to defame other countries by name, then the UK should be prepared to have its own monumental corruption problems put under the spotlight.

This is about financial corruption; corruption in other spheres - police, judiciary and politics - is rife in the UK too.

The only question about whether the UK is the "worst" is whether other so-called open, accountable democracies are any better, which I doubt.

But it's about time we started putting our own house in order, instead of blindly pointing the finger at the usual suspects, poor developing countries, who can only dream of having corruption so established that it's not even referred to as such; and when someone does call it what it is, people instinctively write it off as "idiotic".

Re: Britain is the most corrupt country in the world?

#20

Spain, not UK, is by far the most corrupt country in Europe. High rank spanish politicians are involved in the Panama Papers.

I think a distinction between most corrupt and largest dollar sums involved in corruption, should be made. The UK is a very wealthy nation with very large, global banking interests. That inherently tilts things in terms of scale.

If we're going by most corrupt, the UK is absolutely not at the top of that list, nor is Spain, in regards to Europe.

I'll go with Transparency International's rankings of most corrupt in Europe, I find it far more plausible: Ukraine at #130 globally, Russia at #119 globally, Belarus at #107. Those last two are fascist dictatorships, the corruption is nearly absolute in terms of state power and abuse.

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