The Black Damsel In Dating Distress: A Response to OkCupid's Conclusions • Hacker News Board

Re: The Black Damsel In Dating Distress: A Response to OkCupid's Conclusions

#11

Post by pw0ncakes » Fri, Mar 05, 2010, 9:33 PM UTC

jbooth wrote: post #9

petercooper wrote: post #7

That's because all the black men who don't want to date white women are on the African American Dating Network or Blacksinglesconnection. There simply is no real white corollary. Stormfront excluded, there aren't many "WhiteSingles" websites or "EliteIvory" dating sites. There is no Caucasian Dating Network, because the broader world is the Caucasian Dating Network. [..] Disagree. The reason there are no popular whit…

When your race makes up 13% of the larger population, the economics for a niche dating site will work out. At 75%, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Also, I can't speak from any racial perspective than that of a white man, but I'm pretty sure I wouldn't want to date a woman who joined a whites-only dating site, and most of the women I've dated or been interested in dating haven't been white anyway.

Re: The Black Damsel In Dating Distress: A Response to OkCupid's Conclusions

#12

Post by mquander » Fri, Mar 05, 2010, 9:34 PM UTC

pw0ncakes wrote: post #8

jrockway wrote: post #5

This isn't explicit anywhere, but OkCupid is all about subgroups. For many people, there is an equal number of guys and girls in each sub-group, so message response rates are consistent and people are generally happy. It seems like, for black girls, that there is not an equal subgroup; there aren't enough guys that find them interesting for all of them. So the girls desperately respond to every message, and the guys…

I'm sure you don't mean to do so, but you shouldn't compare black women to "u r so hawt" guys. Very different categories, and very different dating problems. The moron can stop being a moron and learn how to write decent messages. In addition, his disadvantage is a shortcoming that sends a strong signal about his worthiness for a relationship. The black woman's disadvantage comes from her being black, which will neve…

I think the parent is trying to make the point that there's no clear evidence here that black women have a systematic disadvantage in general, just a disadvantage in the self-selected OKCupid community. (No comment on whether there's evidence of such elsewhere.)

Re: The Black Damsel In Dating Distress: A Response to OkCupid's Conclusions

#13

Post by robotron » Fri, Mar 05, 2010, 9:37 PM UTC

petercooper wrote: post #7

That's because all the black men who don't want to date white women are on the African American Dating Network or Blacksinglesconnection. There simply is no real white corollary. Stormfront excluded, there aren't many "WhiteSingles" websites or "EliteIvory" dating sites. There is no Caucasian Dating Network, because the broader world is the Caucasian Dating Network. [..] Disagree. The reason there are no popular whit…

petercooper has a very valid point. A whitedating.com site would cause an uproar, even if it was done as tastefully as possible. The anti-racist reactive culture we have is too quick to jump on something like that.

Note: I'm not white.

Re: The Black Damsel In Dating Distress: A Response to OkCupid's Conclusions

#14

Post by carbocation » Fri, Mar 05, 2010, 9:41 PM UTC

danieldon wrote: post #10

Hopefully everyone here can recognize that Ta-Nehisi Coates' post simply presents a hypothesis and contains absolutely no supporting data.

He is relying on the same data for his assertions as everyone else has been. I see his analysis of that data as no less valid than that of OKCupid, etc.

Re: The Black Damsel In Dating Distress: A Response to OkCupid's Conclusions

#15

Post by henrikschroder » Fri, Mar 05, 2010, 9:42 PM UTC

petercooper wrote: post #7

That's because all the black men who don't want to date white women are on the African American Dating Network or Blacksinglesconnection. There simply is no real white corollary. Stormfront excluded, there aren't many "WhiteSingles" websites or "EliteIvory" dating sites. There is no Caucasian Dating Network, because the broader world is the Caucasian Dating Network. [..] Disagree. The reason there are no popular whit…

Why should it be hideous?

Let me try an analogy. Discrimination based on sexual orientation is illegal in a lot of places, and seen as equally bad as discrimination based on race.

But there are plenty of dating sites that are exclusively targeted to gay men or lesbian women. If you think that race segregating dating sites are bad, then what are dating sites that segregate on sexual orientation? Are they also bad?

But a gay dating site that didn't segregate on sexual orientation would be completely useless! And to the extent gay men are members of non-segregating dating sites, they will definitely filter out all the women and be filtered out by all the straight men, so in essence they would self-segregate.

We have anti-discrimination laws because race or gender or sexual orientation are irrelevant in some areas, such as the ability to perform a job. That's why it's illegal to deny a job applicant based on those attributes.

But when it comes to dating, those attributes are relevant! Incredibly relevant! Everyone has preferences when it comes to dating, and it not racist to only date people of one's own race. It is not sexist to only date people of one's preferred gender. It is not bad to want to date people that share your culture, your religion, your world view.

It is not bad or distasteful to have segregated dating sites.

Re: The Black Damsel In Dating Distress: A Response to OkCupid's Conclusions

#16

Post by byrneseyeview » Fri, Mar 05, 2010, 9:46 PM UTC

pw0ncakes wrote: post #11

jbooth wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When your race makes up 13% of the larger population, the economics for a niche dating site will work out. At 75%, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Also, I can't speak from any racial perspective than that of a white man, but I'm pretty sure I wouldn't want to date a woman who joined a whites-only dating site, and most of the women I've dated or been interested in dating haven't been white anyway.

Why is that? Would you refuse to date a Jewish woman who had signed up on Jdate? (Assume you met her outside of Jdate.)

Re: The Black Damsel In Dating Distress: A Response to OkCupid's Conclusions

#17

Post by thrdOriginal » Fri, Mar 05, 2010, 9:47 PM UTC

danieldon wrote: post #10

Hopefully everyone here can recognize that Ta-Nehisi Coates' post simply presents a hypothesis and contains absolutely no supporting data.

I thought his article did a good job of logically asserting his point. What kind of data do you absolutely need that he didn't provide in order to believe that OKCupid is but a small part of a bigger picture when it comes to black women and (online) dating?

Re: The Black Damsel In Dating Distress: A Response to OkCupid's Conclusions

#18

Post by danieldon » Fri, Mar 05, 2010, 9:48 PM UTC

carbocation wrote: post #14

danieldon wrote: post #10

Hopefully everyone here can recognize that Ta-Nehisi Coates' post simply presents a hypothesis and contains absolutely no supporting data.

He is relying on the same data for his assertions as everyone else has been. I see his analysis of that data as no less valid than that of OKCupid, etc.

Maybe you read a different post, but the one linked here simply argues that "any black person will tell you, when black folks date online they don't go to OKcupid," then lists a bunch of sites targeting black users and concludes that the OKCupid data is not representative of the public at large, despite the complete absence of supporting data. I don't see an analysis of data, just a hypothesis.

Re: The Black Damsel In Dating Distress: A Response to OkCupid's Conclusions

#19

Post by danieldon » Fri, Mar 05, 2010, 9:49 PM UTC

thrdOriginal wrote: post #17

danieldon wrote: post #10

Hopefully everyone here can recognize that Ta-Nehisi Coates' post simply presents a hypothesis and contains absolutely no supporting data.

I thought his article did a good job of logically asserting his point. What kind of data do you absolutely need that he didn't provide in order to believe that OKCupid is but a small part of a bigger picture when it comes to black women and (online) dating?

    What kind of data do you absolutely need...?

The kind of data that demonstrates that the OKCupid data doesn't reflect broader dating patterns.

Re: The Black Damsel In Dating Distress: A Response to OkCupid's Conclusions

#20

Post by byrneseyeview » Fri, Mar 05, 2010, 9:51 PM UTC

It's more parsimonious to just assume that black women have fewer options.

Black men between 20 and 34 (prime mate-choosing years) have an 11% incarceration rate. The unemployment rate and median income among (unincarcerated) black men is also low. So black women are more likely to need to look for people of a different racial background.

That means that if everyone has a slight bias towards their own ethnic group, it's going to hit black women the hardest. (It would be a pretty strange mutation if you didn't have that bias.)

Thus, they have to try the hardest, and have the least to show for it.

Or they're on Ebony Elite.