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Go Game Guru – Learn all about the board game Go

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Re: Go Game Guru – Learn all about the board game Go

#11

Post by kqr »

chrisherring wrote: post #7

I've started playing Go against a computer (SmartGo iOS on a 9x9 board) but I find the hard part is determining where you're making mistakes, what is a better move, why the computer did what it did etc. For instance the computer may ignore a capture to play elsewhere and it can be hard to work out why. I learnt to play Chess when I was young so I can't make a fair comparison but it feels like Chess is much easier to…

The general principle is that captures aren't actually worth a whole lot. Territory (area under your control) is where it's at. If a capture is a means of getting more territory, that's grand, but on it's own it's not worth much at all.

Does this help your self diagnosis? If the computer ignored a capture it's because it didn't actually lead to a lot of territory gained, whereas whatever move it played probably did.

Re: Go Game Guru – Learn all about the board game Go

#12

Post by weavie »

chrisherring wrote: post #7

I've started playing Go against a computer (SmartGo iOS on a 9x9 board) but I find the hard part is determining where you're making mistakes, what is a better move, why the computer did what it did etc. For instance the computer may ignore a capture to play elsewhere and it can be hard to work out why. I learnt to play Chess when I was young so I can't make a fair comparison but it feels like Chess is much easier to…

I am finding doing Go puzzles help here. I have an android app, I'm sure there are iOS equivalents. The puzzles only seem to tell you when you have made a wrong move and not why, but after spending some time thinking about it it usually comes clear.

Re: Go Game Guru – Learn all about the board game Go

#13

Post by tasuki »

chrisherring wrote: post #7

I've started playing Go against a computer (SmartGo iOS on a 9x9 board) but I find the hard part is determining where you're making mistakes, what is a better move, why the computer did what it did etc. For instance the computer may ignore a capture to play elsewhere and it can be hard to work out why. I learnt to play Chess when I was young so I can't make a fair comparison but it feels like Chess is much easier to…

This is the single biggest issue with introducing go to newcomers. In chess, the goal is crystal clear - capture the king. In go, the goal of having more points than your opponent is somehow very challenging to grasp in an intuitive way.

There's a common advice to lose your first 50 games as quickly as possible (http://senseis.xmp.net/?LoseYourFirst50GamesAsQuicklyAsPossi...). This will give you some basic intuition about the game. After a couple more hundred games, go becomes very beautiful.

Re: Go Game Guru – Learn all about the board game Go

#14

Post by tasuki »

lucb1e wrote: post #2

Slightly off topic perhaps, but I've been looking to buy a Go game. Dutch sites don't seem to have it for a reasonable price; this site sells it for $9.99 but with $18 shipping. Any Europeans here who can tell me how to get it to either a German, Belgian or Dutch address for about €20 or less?

There are many go clubs in the Netherlands. Find one, go and play with people! While you are at it, you can ask them about buying a go board and will probably be able to buy one without having to pay for shipping at all.

Re: Go Game Guru – Learn all about the board game Go

#15

Post by chrisherring »

kqr wrote: post #11
chrisherring wrote: post #7

I've started playing Go against a computer (SmartGo iOS on a 9x9 board) but I find the hard part is determining where you're making mistakes, what is a better move, why the computer did what it did etc. For instance the computer may ignore a capture to play elsewhere and it can be hard to work out why. I learnt to play Chess when I was young so I can't make a fair comparison but it feels like Chess is much easier to…

The general principle is that captures aren't actually worth a whole lot. Territory (area under your control) is where it's at. If a capture is a means of getting more territory, that's grand, but on it's own it's not worth much at all. Does this help your self diagnosis? If the computer ignored a capture it's because it didn't actually lead to a lot of territory gained, whereas whatever move it played probably did.

That thinking does help, I did read that on one of the sites as well but in some cases the capture appears to mean the loss of territory itself in addition to the actual pieces and it's hard to weigh up the value of each territory.

Re: Go Game Guru – Learn all about the board game Go

#16

Post by niij »

If you're shopping for a Go set, I would recommend looking at http://www.thegamesupply.com/go-game-sets/

There are a few medium quality boards on there. There is a $70 set with free shipping that includes:

• 1 full size (17"x18") wooden board with wooden feet

• 320 Bi-convex glass stones with plastic containers

Re: Go Game Guru – Learn all about the board game Go

#18

Post by jdietrich »

lucb1e wrote: post #2

Slightly off topic perhaps, but I've been looking to buy a Go game. Dutch sites don't seem to have it for a reasonable price; this site sells it for $9.99 but with $18 shipping. Any Europeans here who can tell me how to get it to either a German, Belgian or Dutch address for about €20 or less?

The cheapest set of playable quality I've found is from GoGameGuru. It includes a wooden board and plastic stones and bowls. It costs €35 shipped to the Netherlands.

https://shop.gogameguru.com/newbie-go-game-set/

I have one of these folding magnetic sets. It's a few centimetres smaller than a standard board, but is perfectly usable and very convenient for study or casual games in cafes. It costs €22 shipped, but you'll have to wait a few weeks as it's sent direct from China.

http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free-shipping-large-magnetic-...

Re: Go Game Guru – Learn all about the board game Go

#19

Post by chrisherring »

tasuki wrote: post #13
chrisherring wrote: post #7

I've started playing Go against a computer (SmartGo iOS on a 9x9 board) but I find the hard part is determining where you're making mistakes, what is a better move, why the computer did what it did etc. For instance the computer may ignore a capture to play elsewhere and it can be hard to work out why. I learnt to play Chess when I was young so I can't make a fair comparison but it feels like Chess is much easier to…

This is the single biggest issue with introducing go to newcomers. In chess, the goal is crystal clear - capture the king. In go, the goal of having more points than your opponent is somehow very challenging to grasp in an intuitive way. There's a common advice to lose your first 50 games as quickly as possible ( http://senseis.xmp.net/?LoseYourFirst50GamesAsQuicklyAsPossi... ). This will give you some basic intuitio…

Plus you can generally see who's in front in Chess just by counting the value of the captured pieces. Where as I would not have been able to workout the result of the AlphaGo v Lee Sedol games just by looking at the final game board.

The beauty of the game is appealing however so I want to get better at it. I'll working on losing more then :)

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