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Clmategate prof admits no warming since 1995

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Re: Clmategate prof admits no warming since 1995

#11

Post by cgranade »

azgolfer wrote: post #10
cgranade wrote: post #7

The plague of climate denialism on HN seems to be getting much worse as of late. Why does trash like this keep getting upvoted?

Because stuff like this http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article702... is now pouring out, and realclimate.org is implicated in the climategate scandal, so you might want to go somewhere else for unbiased information

"Unbiased information." That's a good one. Why I linked to realclimate.org is because, unlike so many denialist sites, they cite the actual studies and the data that are the basis of our understanding. In that sense, realclimate.org is one of the absolute least biased sites you can possibly refer to: they are biased only in that they accurately and dutifully report on the data.

By the way, when you refer to "the climategate scandal," you really don't do yourself any favors. There is no "climategate scandal" other than that a well-coordinated group of hackers (in the negative sense of the word) committed criminal acts in order to embarrass scientists and undermine the perceived validity of their work. Indeed, in that sense, "climategate" is much like the Watergate scandal, and you seem to be throwing your lot in with the villains of this story. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you aren't evil, manipulative or duplicitous, but merely ignorant. There's many good (read, well-cited) sources dedicated to debunking the poisonous myth that is "climategate," such as http://scienceblogs.com/islandofdoubt/2009/12/the_climategat.... For more general information, please see http://scienceblogs.com/illconsidered/2008/07/how_to_talk_to....

Re: Clmategate prof admits no warming since 1995

#12

Post by azgolfer »

cgranade wrote: post #11
azgolfer wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because stuff like this http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article702... is now pouring out, and realclimate.org is implicated in the climategate scandal, so you might want to go somewhere else for unbiased information

"Unbiased information." That's a good one. Why I linked to realclimate.org is because, unlike so many denialist sites, they cite the actual studies and the data that are the basis of our understanding. In that sense, realclimate.org is one of the absolute least biased sites you can possibly refer to: they are biased only in that they accurately and dutifully report on the data. By the way, when you refer to "the clim…

That article is about one of the IPCC authors validating a 'denialists' claim. It is the climategate scientists that broke the law, but the statute of limitations had expired (it is only six months, the law is seriously flawed), so they haven't been prosecuted. Here is another example of someone going directly from the raw data and finding no warming http://www.bestinclass.dk/index.php/2010/01/global-warming/

Re: Clmategate prof admits no warming since 1995

#13

Post by mnemonicsloth »

azgolfer wrote: post #12
cgranade wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Unbiased information." That's a good one. Why I linked to realclimate.org is because, unlike so many denialist sites, they cite the actual studies and the data that are the basis of our understanding. In that sense, realclimate.org is one of the absolute least biased sites you can possibly refer to: they are biased only in that they accurately and dutifully report on the data. By the way, when you refer to "the clim…

That article is about one of the IPCC authors validating a 'denialists' claim. It is the climategate scientists that broke the law, but the statute of limitations had expired (it is only six months, the law is seriously flawed), so they haven't been prosecuted. Here is another example of someone going directly from the raw data and finding no warming http://www.bestinclass.dk/index.php/2010/01/global-warming/

Dude, calm down. Missionary zeal on a topic this contentious makes you look like a conspiracy nut. Be happy that reasoned skepticism is respectable again, and don't try to force other people to change their minds at a pace of your choosing.

Re: Clmategate prof admits no warming since 1995

#14

Post by mnemonicsloth »

cgranade wrote: post #9
azgolfer wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here is the most recent example of someone looking into the GISS data. http://wattsupwiththat.com/2010/02/11/giss-adjustments-in-au... The models have obvious warming biased 'adjustments' built into them and there is no model, which when given the correct inputs at a point in time would successfully predict the climate for a following period of time. The 'Hockey Stick' graph, which eliminates the Midieval Warm period…

Thank you for citing your claims. Now I am not familiar with the particulars of the alleged manipulations by GISS in Australia, but I would note a few things. One, the analysis in your citation was missing any sort of error analysis, and so it is impossible to formulate a statistical hypothesis test of the claimed manipulations. Being a personal blog, I wouldn't expect more, but without that sort of detailed statisti…

Some of the hacked emails from the University of East Anglia discussed how to manipulate discussion on realclimate.org by passing AGW-supportive comments through moderation quickly while allowing AGW-skeptical ones to linger indefinitely.

Is it responsible to keep assuming, then, that the ideas presented at RealClimate.org are a legitimate indicator of the state of scientific opinion on this topic? Can you provide links to other sources?

You should also moderate your tone. A lot. I've been reading and talking to people about global warming since the early 90s, and I'm strongly predisposed to take scientists at their word. If the stridency in your writing can make me want to close my laptop and take a nap, it's certain to stir up angry feelings in people who vehemently oppose to the idea of global warming. They will respond in kind, HN will get a little less civil, hence a little less useful for everyone. And you will bear part of the responsibility.

Re: Clmategate prof admits no warming since 1995

#15

Post by azgolfer »

mnemonicsloth wrote: post #13
azgolfer wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That article is about one of the IPCC authors validating a 'denialists' claim. It is the climategate scientists that broke the law, but the statute of limitations had expired (it is only six months, the law is seriously flawed), so they haven't been prosecuted. Here is another example of someone going directly from the raw data and finding no warming http://www.bestinclass.dk/index.php/2010/01/global-warming/

Dude, calm down. Missionary zeal on a topic this contentious makes you look like a conspiracy nut. Be happy that reasoned skepticism is respectable again, and don't try to force other people to change their minds at a pace of your choosing.

I was just getting interested, and that was never five minutes.
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