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Linux has matured into a robust desktop operating system

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Re: Linux has matured into a robust desktop operating system

#11
My lily-white ass it has. If anything, my experience with the Linux distro ecosystem in the last year is worse than I have ever had with Linux going back some 20 years. I would frankly trade any of the dozens of broken "robust desktop distros" for just Red Hat 7 or Mandrake or early 2000's Debian.

I have gone through any of nearly a dozen different distros in the last year, Debian, Ubuntu, Mint, Fedora, more I'm probably forgetting, and every single one of them failed within weeks. Most wouldn't even boot on my hardware, others had weird limitations, while still others just completely ate themselves during routine updates or version changes.

At this point I'd sooner use FreeBSD, or swallow my annoyance with PC-BSD's security model and give that another go.

Re: Linux has matured into a robust desktop operating system

#12
post #7

And yet as of 2015, getting sound to work properly is still a crapshoot. Artsd was a major pain 13 years ago, I'm sure pulseaudio has more features today, but it's still an intractable mess.

What is on in your end that sound is still such an issue? Admittedly my system is PulseAudio-free with only one exception, that being Skype. I should consider using a compatibility layer like apulse that just multiplexes ALSA calls under the hood.

I've been using Linux as my primary desktop OS for about 15 years, and sound has always been a pain to deal with. I used S/PDIF on my last machine, and it took me months of browsing through endless threads to get the thing to work properly. Skype just won't play any sound as of my last install, I have no idea why, I've given up on it.

To get my last monitor to work properly, I had to manually enter modelines in xorg.conf. If the monitor goes in powersave mode, the full resolution won't be available until I restart X. (It's a Seiki 4K TV, not standard by any means, but hardly "exotic")

Honestly, at this point, I wouldn't recommend desktop Linux to anyone normal, I just tell them to get an Apple computer.

Re: Linux has matured into a robust desktop operating system

#13
post #11

My lily-white ass it has. If anything, my experience with the Linux distro ecosystem in the last year is worse than I have ever had with Linux going back some 20 years. I would frankly trade any of the dozens of broken "robust desktop distros" for just Red Hat 7 or Mandrake or early 2000's Debian. I have gone through any of nearly a dozen different distros in the last year, Debian, Ubuntu, Mint, Fedora, more I'm prob…

Is your hardware supported?

Re: Linux has matured into a robust desktop operating system

#14
post #8
post #6

With (at least currently) the worst security model of them all. Yay!

Care to elaborate ?

I think he's referring to X? X is a terrible system. For instance, the "screen lock" on X11 desktops is just a full screen window that captures focus.

Re: Linux has matured into a robust desktop operating system

#15
- Linux is as far from a gaming platform as ever.

- Hardware issues are major PITA, touchpads never work, when you have a convertible laptop, keyboard doesn't disable when turning it into a tablet mode and so on. Not to mention audio.

- No distro has nice fonts.

- In my case, Ubuntu took exactly an hour before throwing an error at me.

I use Linux every day and I prefer it to Windows or Mac OS X, but take your pink glasses off, please.

Re: Linux has matured into a robust desktop operating system

#16
Unfortunately, no. I use Linux on a daily basis on my desktop, and while it's great for development (if you develop for Linux), it sucks for everything else (compared to Windows, for example).

> Linux is now a viable gaming platform, thanks in large part to the efforts of Valve and GOG.com. Six of the top ten games on Steam right now support Linux.

No. Look at the most recent SteamOS/PC review from Ars: http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2015/11/ars-benchmarks-show-si... -- even the purpose-built PCs deliver significantly lower performance with Linux than Windows.

> Hardware support is no longer a major issue. You can generally expect all your devices to work out of the box. Even your WiFi.

Not really. AMD GPUs are badly supported -- even the proprietary driver is _very_ slow compared to the Windows version and it has very crude power management (meaning that most of the time, your GPU runs loud and hot). The NVidia side is much better, but still tends to crash more than on Windows or OSX (things like WebGL are not 100% stable). Hybrid graphics is not supported properly, so laptops like my ZBook 15 G2 can't run Linux well (there is no solution that provides on-demand GPU switching AND proper external monitor support at the same time).

In general, my biggest issue with Linux on the desktop is stability of things related to graphics/display. My quite standard desktop (Xeons, NVidia GPU, SATA SSDs) cannot boot with the most recent Ubuntu image. Fedora 23 installs well, then the first software update breaks graphics (it turned out that GDM cannot communicate with X due some SELinux misconfiguration). I could install CentOS7 which is officially supported by the manufacturer but that has crappy font rendering and obsolete packages.

And sadly, the situation in 2015 does not seem better than ~10 years ago, when I was trying to install Linux on my X40. Everything worked well except the graphics. Same in 2015.

Look at what Windows is doing with WDDM and DX12. It's really-really cutting edge. Yes, Vulkan is coming sometime, but MS has actually delivered. But still, as a Linux dev, that's not an alternative.

Re: Linux has matured into a robust desktop operating system

#17

> We need a consistent way for third-parties to distribute software Isn't this what package managers are all about? - a thing which, by the way, I believe the notion of an "App Store" from the other two OSes took inspiration from.

The problem is package managers aren't consistent across distributions. If you want to provide a binary version of your app, you should be providing at least .deb, .rpm and tarball packages. In practice, everyone's just targeting Ubuntu and publishing .debs.

And that is not enough, if the package needs to call distribution specific tools or access specific paths.

Re: Linux has matured into a robust desktop operating system

#19
post #9

I agree, I love Fedora 23 and Gnome, except for those 2-3 times a month I actually need to print a document and do not have 7 hours to spare....

I use a brother printer with debian and I haven't even thought about printing being an issue. It works.
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