Portugal's Velocidade Controlada – speed control traffic signals • Hacker News Board

Re: Portugal's Velocidade Controlada – speed control traffic signals

#11

Post by bradtemp » Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 2:47 AM UTC

eCa wrote: post #2

When I travelled through Spain back in '99 these were pretty common. They usually turned green when cars had slowed down to the speed limit. I travelled by bike so I didn't trigger them very often.. > Robocars of course would know where all these are and never trigger one, even if the occupants have commanded the vehicle to exceed the limit. I will be very surprised if occupants of self driving vehicles have that opt…

Be surprised, then. Google's cars have it. In fact, it would be unsafe not to have it, and the history of attempting to force people with technology in their cars to limit their speed is a history of that never happening.

Re: Portugal's Velocidade Controlada – speed control traffic signals

#12

Post by dzhiurgis » Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 3:02 AM UTC

Sounds like a great opportunity to mass produce and sell to other countries.

If you employ solar and use readily available components, they must come out cheaper than doing roadwork.

Sending photos to centralized database might be more expensive part, but then, perhaps those could be relayed for free via WiFi around (more social pressure).

Re: Portugal's Velocidade Controlada – speed control traffic signals

#13

Post by davnicwil » Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 4:31 AM UTC

bradtemp wrote: post #11

eCa wrote: post #2

When I travelled through Spain back in '99 these were pretty common. They usually turned green when cars had slowed down to the speed limit. I travelled by bike so I didn't trigger them very often.. > Robocars of course would know where all these are and never trigger one, even if the occupants have commanded the vehicle to exceed the limit. I will be very surprised if occupants of self driving vehicles have that opt…

Be surprised, then. Google's cars have it. In fact, it would be unsafe not to have it, and the history of attempting to force people with technology in their cars to limit their speed is a history of that never happening.

> Google's cars have it.

I had to look this up, not because I didn't believe you but just to verify and read about the reasoning behind it.

The main point I got is that breaking the speed limit intentionally is done to match other speeding traffic and thus not cause a hazard by going slowly relative to everyone else on a section of road.

Whether or not this makes sense, I find it completely unbelievable that this will be explicitly allowed by regulations in basically any country, as a completely autonomous strategic decision by the car's computer.

Perhaps I could see it being 'allowed' as an option to be manually toggled by a human - in the same way that most current road-legal cars have the capability to reach speeds way beyond the limit and yet remain legal.

The law wouldn't explicitly allow this option to be used, but it of course would be, and a blind eye would be turned in cases where it's obviously not a problem, and prosecutions against the human who enabled the option would occur in cases where it is - in other words how speeding laws are currently enforced.

Re: Portugal's Velocidade Controlada – speed control traffic signals

#14

Post by bradtemp » Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 4:56 AM UTC

davnicwil wrote: post #13

bradtemp wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Be surprised, then. Google's cars have it. In fact, it would be unsafe not to have it, and the history of attempting to force people with technology in their cars to limit their speed is a history of that never happening.

> Google's cars have it. I had to look this up, not because I didn't believe you but just to verify and read about the reasoning behind it. The main point I got is that breaking the speed limit intentionally is done to match other speeding traffic and thus not cause a hazard by going slowly relative to everyone else on a section of road. Whether or not this makes sense, I find it completely unbelievable that this wil…

The law doesn't allow you to speed, and tickets you if you do. The law does not require your cruise control or throttle block you from speeding if you choose to do so. Yes, you need it to not be a hazard to traffic (as you would be at 65mph on I-280) but also because if you don't allow it, then people in a hurry will switch to manual driving to go fast, thus reducing safety overall.

It's not "allowed" by regulations. The regulations simply don't speak to it. But in Canada, for example, speed limiters in cars were found to violate the constitutional rights of drivers!

Re: Portugal's Velocidade Controlada – speed control traffic signals

#15

Post by stevep98 » Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 5:56 AM UTC

joeyo wrote: post #4

Sounds a little bit like (though more sophisticated than) the timed lights that some cities employ, for example Oak and Fell streets in San Francisco. If you go the speed limit you'll get green all the way though; if you speed you'll just sit at a red light.

I'm pretty sure there was a light that did this in Virginia. Possibly on Route 7 North of Reston. Long stretch of road with no intersections, and a light seemingly for no purpose.

Re: Portugal's Velocidade Controlada – speed control traffic signals

#16

Post by smackay » Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 6:21 AM UTC

The interesting part of Velocidade Controlada is the attitude/culture behind it: prevention rather than punishment. Compare this to the UK where the equivalent system is a hidden camera and a series fines with the intention on criminalizing the driver.

Now if only this kinds of enlightened thinking could be exteneded to driving and talking on cell phones, driving at 200 km/h on the main highways and excessive speed at cross-walks then the roads in Portugal could become much safer and fewer lives would the ruined.

Re: Portugal's Velocidade Controlada – speed control traffic signals

#17

Post by eb0la » Mon, Oct 05, 2015, 7:57 AM UTC

eCa wrote: post #2

When I travelled through Spain back in '99 these were pretty common. They usually turned green when cars had slowed down to the speed limit. I travelled by bike so I didn't trigger them very often.. > Robocars of course would know where all these are and never trigger one, even if the occupants have commanded the vehicle to exceed the limit. I will be very surprised if occupants of self driving vehicles have that opt…

They're still very common in secondary (rural) roads. I Hope you did enjoy the trip.