Ask HN: Are there software companies that don't “make” you work all day long? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: Are there software companies that don't “make” you work all day long?

#11

Post by jeffmould » Thu, Sep 03, 2015, 1:00 AM UTC

wintermute42 wrote: post #6

jeffmould wrote: post #2

Not to be a smart ass, it is called work for a reason, and to be expected to put in 8 hours a day is a reasonable request from any employer. With that said, there is a difference between being "expected" to work 40 hours a week and being "expected" to work 80 hours a week. If you were coming to work for me I would be a little upset if you sat at your desk and read a book the entire time you were there. However, if yo…

I'm talking more like 10-13 here...

Without fully understanding the environment it is honestly difficult to say. If you are expected to be at your desk coding that entire time I would say it is completely unreasonable and would run for the hills immediately. However, if those people you say are working 10-13 hours a day, but in reality they are talking, playing ping-pong, out to lunch, etc.. during that time it really isn't 10-13 hours. That's just poor time management. It could also be that management doesn't do a good job of keeping projects in check so that leads to longer hours worked to finish projects on time. Going back to the reading question though, some people may view sitting at your desk reading as not working, while at the same time they will play ping-pong for the same amount of time. There can be a perception that if you are interacting with others you are "working".

I am probably the wrong person to answer this question though. I am not a firm believer in structured work hours unless there is an absolute customer requirement. I have hours in the day where I am more productive and hours where I am completely unproductive. I have learned to manage that to maximize my productivity. However, during those "down" hours some may view it as not being productive, but what they don't know is that I have been up since 4am and probably got more done by 7am than they will all day. I view it as if the job gets done properly and on time it doesn't matter how it gets done.

Re: Ask HN: Are there software companies that don't “make” you work all day long?

#12

Post by PaulHoule » Thu, Sep 03, 2015, 1:45 AM UTC

jeffmould wrote: post #11

wintermute42 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm talking more like 10-13 here...

Without fully understanding the environment it is honestly difficult to say. If you are expected to be at your desk coding that entire time I would say it is completely unreasonable and would run for the hills immediately. However, if those people you say are working 10-13 hours a day, but in reality they are talking, playing ping-pong, out to lunch, etc.. during that time it really isn't 10-13 hours. That's just poo…

I went to a job interview at a place where they worked 12 hour days but you'd see people were watching eBay, trading stocks, and otherwise wasting time.

Re: Ask HN: Are there software companies that don't “make” you work all day long?

#13

Post by jeffmould » Thu, Sep 03, 2015, 3:34 AM UTC

PaulHoule wrote: post #12

jeffmould wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Without fully understanding the environment it is honestly difficult to say. If you are expected to be at your desk coding that entire time I would say it is completely unreasonable and would run for the hills immediately. However, if those people you say are working 10-13 hours a day, but in reality they are talking, playing ping-pong, out to lunch, etc.. during that time it really isn't 10-13 hours. That's just poo…

I went to a job interview at a place where they worked 12 hour days but you'd see people were watching eBay, trading stocks, and otherwise wasting time.

Yep, I have seen people that claim to work "all these hours" and that they have to work weekends. But when you watch them work they spend 5-6 hours a day on Facebook, YouTube, etc... Then they get so far behind they have to work extra to make up for the wasted time, yet they complain about all the hours they work. I don't claim to be perfect and I can be guilty of "wondering off" from time to time reading news sites and even Facebook. I just try not to make it an everyday work habit.

Re: Ask HN: Are there software companies that don't “make” you work all day long?

#14

Post by tixocloud » Thu, Sep 03, 2015, 6:32 PM UTC

Having been a software engineer for about 4 years, there were times when I remember having to put in extra hours to get things done. However, the majority of my time there has been really pleasant. We were never forced to work all day long so I believe it's more of a corporate culture more than anything else.

Call me crazy but I believe that it is possible to build a company where people can do amazing things without being forced to work extra hours. It's definitely on my to do list with my startup.

Re: Ask HN: Are there software companies that don't “make” you work all day long?

#15

Post by MalcolmDiggs » Fri, Sep 04, 2015, 4:40 PM UTC

Academic institutions (and non-profits) don't necessarily function the same way as corporations. You can expect managers in a for-profit organization to try and squeeze every ounce of productivity out of you. That's their job, really. They'd be doing a disservice to shareholders/stakeholders if they didn't try to get you to put 100% of your time and energy into the company.

So if you want breaks, you just have to take them. If you want to work 6 hours instead of 8,10,12, (or take part of your day to continue your education), you're going to have to "just do it". But no, I wouldn't expect anyone who is responsible for your output to give you 'permission' to work fewer hours, or work less intensely. They will always ask for more, and you've just got to learn how to push back.

In other words: You've got to learn how to be just as strong as an advocate for your own well-being as they are for the company's. Once you learn these skills, it's quite possible to have a good work/life balance, and to make time for the things you find important.