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Dinner and Deception – Serving meals to the super-rich left me feeling empty

nytimes.com

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Re: Dinner and Deception – Serving meals to the super-rich left me feeling empty

#11

Post by icanhackit »

A_COMPUTER wrote: post #5

I love the commenters describing it as being like a scene from Bonfire of the Vanities or serving Egyptian pharaohs. Speaking from experience, there are plenty of poor people that are at least as aloof, entitled and rude to service staff as rich people, often times even worse. And corporate restaurants/stores mimic the same patterns as shown here, you just get paid less and treated worse.

there are plenty of poor people that are at least as aloof, entitled and rude to service staff as rich people

We need a reverse Yelp that reviews humans rather than businesses. So many people fail to follow the Golden Rule in simple, everyday interactions for no discernible advantage to themselves at the cost of dignity, respect and efficiency.

Some customers you don't want. And the customer is not always right. A sort of trade embargo in response to poor behavior would be interesting.

Re: Dinner and Deception – Serving meals to the super-rich left me feeling empty

#12

Post by eli_gottlieb »

smtucker wrote: post #9
beloch wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In high-school I worked in a restaurant. Not high-end, but decent enough that some customers expected a lot. Most customers were respectable human beings, but there were a few sad and pathetic misanthropes who acted as though paying money gave them absolute power over you. Those customers were enough to make the job feel a bit like prostitution. At a high end restaurant I'd imagine this effect is intensified, both by…

You "imagine" the effect is intensified but you don't actually have any evidence to support it. I've also worked at a restaurant as a waiter. Despite it being a very low end buffet where the food was cheap and wages low I identify completely with the article (except nobody had a stroke while I was working). The only real difference was that the author and his co-workers were much better at their jobs than me and my o…

>Wealth is a big red herring in this story, but I guess its a story no one would be interested in without.

Well of course. Nobody's interested in stories about poor people: they're too common.

Re: Dinner and Deception – Serving meals to the super-rich left me feeling empty

#13

Post by freshhawk »

A_COMPUTER wrote: post #5

I love the commenters describing it as being like a scene from Bonfire of the Vanities or serving Egyptian pharaohs. Speaking from experience, there are plenty of poor people that are at least as aloof, entitled and rude to service staff as rich people, often times even worse. And corporate restaurants/stores mimic the same patterns as shown here, you just get paid less and treated worse.

I assumed the difference they are picking up on and the one that prompted the comparison is the culture of pretending that excellence at this job is meaningful. The large teams of people and the rules of the dance also make it very clear that you are not there to ensure a pleasant and efficient "dining experience". You are very much also there to act subservient and to be used as the object of a status display. The fact that you have a "bullshit job" is constantly thrown in your face.

And there is certainly one difference I've noticed between the crap treatment of employees at an average place and top end. The entitled lower or middle class asshole will berate a server because they screwed something up that is simple, with the assumption that they could have done it correctly if they cared. Much more likely to get the reaction of "oh dear, you aren't even of good enough breeding to be an acceptable servant" at the high end places.

And the people who act that way at an average restaurant are disliked by the majority of people, another table might say "Wow, what an ass. Sorry you have to deal with that." At somewhere like this you get treated that way by the people who your entire society has decided are worth listening to and who's opinions and judgement are highly valued.

Re: Dinner and Deception – Serving meals to the super-rich left me feeling empty

#14

Post by quesera »

icanhackit wrote: post #11
A_COMPUTER wrote: post #5

I love the commenters describing it as being like a scene from Bonfire of the Vanities or serving Egyptian pharaohs. Speaking from experience, there are plenty of poor people that are at least as aloof, entitled and rude to service staff as rich people, often times even worse. And corporate restaurants/stores mimic the same patterns as shown here, you just get paid less and treated worse.

there are plenty of poor people that are at least as aloof, entitled and rude to service staff as rich people We need a reverse Yelp that reviews humans rather than businesses. So many people fail to follow the Golden Rule in simple, everyday interactions for no discernible advantage to themselves at the cost of dignity, respect and efficiency. Some customers you don't want. And the customer is not always right. A so…

> We need a reverse Yelp that reviews humans rather than businesses.

I'd like that for drivers. My vehicle should be aware of the vehicles nearby and the likely drivers thereof, and present me with a HUD showing the poorly-reviewed in red.

Re: Dinner and Deception – Serving meals to the super-rich left me feeling empty

#15

Post by wpietri »

wtbob wrote: post #8
A_COMPUTER wrote: post #5

I love the commenters describing it as being like a scene from Bonfire of the Vanities or serving Egyptian pharaohs. Speaking from experience, there are plenty of poor people that are at least as aloof, entitled and rude to service staff as rich people, often times even worse. And corporate restaurants/stores mimic the same patterns as shown here, you just get paid less and treated worse.

> Speaking from experience, there are plenty of poor people that are at least as aloof, entitled and rude to service staff as rich people, often times even worse. Yup. One of my brothers was a waiter for many years in a town where it was easy to tell the lower classes from the upper; it wasn't just common for him to receive no or little tip when he waited on members of the lower classes, it was the rule . In years, I…

For me, there are two big differences.

One, I'm more willing to forgive those with less privilege for errors of ignorance or misplaced reactions to trauma. Part of what privilege gets you is space to learn and to work our your issues.

Two, poor people can't afford to buy much in the way of service, so their ability to mistreat other poor people is limited. The richer the person, though, the more personal service they can consume, and the more power they have over those workers.

Re: Dinner and Deception – Serving meals to the super-rich left me feeling empty

#16

Post by wpietri »

quesera wrote: post #14
icanhackit wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

there are plenty of poor people that are at least as aloof, entitled and rude to service staff as rich people We need a reverse Yelp that reviews humans rather than businesses. So many people fail to follow the Golden Rule in simple, everyday interactions for no discernible advantage to themselves at the cost of dignity, respect and efficiency. Some customers you don't want. And the customer is not always right. A so…

> We need a reverse Yelp that reviews humans rather than businesses. I'd like that for drivers . My vehicle should be aware of the vehicles nearby and the likely drivers thereof, and present me with a HUD showing the poorly-reviewed in red.

I have often imagined a dashcam that does license plate recognition and lets you know when shitty drivers are nearby. And of course, it would have voice response so you could give nearby cars compliments and public grumbles. Presumably you'd also want it to be geosensitive and real time, so that it could say, "Hey, there's a lunatic coming up behind you."

Seems like it would be easy to put together a dash stand, some OpenCV magic, and a little glue logic to get a prototype together.

Re: Dinner and Deception – Serving meals to the super-rich left me feeling empty

#17

Post by bcook »

quesera wrote: post #14
icanhackit wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

there are plenty of poor people that are at least as aloof, entitled and rude to service staff as rich people We need a reverse Yelp that reviews humans rather than businesses. So many people fail to follow the Golden Rule in simple, everyday interactions for no discernible advantage to themselves at the cost of dignity, respect and efficiency. Some customers you don't want. And the customer is not always right. A so…

> We need a reverse Yelp that reviews humans rather than businesses. I'd like that for drivers . My vehicle should be aware of the vehicles nearby and the likely drivers thereof, and present me with a HUD showing the poorly-reviewed in red.

You two have my support.

A psychiatrist acquaintance told me some people almost reflexively lose control and must take advantage of a chance to belittle someone in a customer/server scenario.

Re: Dinner and Deception – Serving meals to the super-rich left me feeling empty

#18

Post by lvs »

roymurdock wrote: post #7

From the comments section: This article is absurd in that this type of work is neither as good or as bad as anything remotely described here. Being a waiter, myself for 24 years including 3 star Michelin (NYC), was a practical, enjoyable professional job in which I dealt with the public. Guests were almost always friendly people looking to have an enjoyable time. This type of writing is bombastic and provocative but…

It is common for two people working, even side-by-side, not to view their job the same way. I'm certain we've all experienced that. Your response to the piece, and that of the commenter you cite, is more indicative of your own mindset about the world rather than the motives of the author.

Re: Dinner and Deception – Serving meals to the super-rich left me feeling empty

#19

Post by geofft »

icanhackit wrote: post #11
A_COMPUTER wrote: post #5

I love the commenters describing it as being like a scene from Bonfire of the Vanities or serving Egyptian pharaohs. Speaking from experience, there are plenty of poor people that are at least as aloof, entitled and rude to service staff as rich people, often times even worse. And corporate restaurants/stores mimic the same patterns as shown here, you just get paid less and treated worse.

there are plenty of poor people that are at least as aloof, entitled and rude to service staff as rich people We need a reverse Yelp that reviews humans rather than businesses. So many people fail to follow the Golden Rule in simple, everyday interactions for no discernible advantage to themselves at the cost of dignity, respect and efficiency. Some customers you don't want. And the customer is not always right. A so…

I can totally see why you want that, but a cross-business blacklist on consumers sounds absurdly dystopian.

(Maybe this means normal-Yelp is dystopian, and maybe I should have more empathy with small businesses complaining about unfair reviews.)

Re: Dinner and Deception – Serving meals to the super-rich left me feeling empty

#20

Post by wpietri »

For those who love the stories of people behind the scenes, it's worth digging around in the Wayback Machine for Bitter Waitress's archives. E.g.:

http://web.archive.org/web/20080917050640/http://www.bitterw...

And my favorite San Francisco story in this vein is "Ice Balls":

http://the-tusk.com/2015/01/09/ice-balls/

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