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Capitalism isn't working and here are the reasons why

theguardian.com

1–10 of 33 posts

Re: Capitalism isn't working and here are the reasons why

#2
Seems important to note that the article doesn't seem to be about capitalism per se, but "business-friendly" capitalism as currently practiced in the U.S. and parts of Europe.

In that regard the conclusion (regarding wealth inequality) really isn't that surprising. If the ROI of having money is really higher than the ROI of earning money (i.e. by wages) then the conclusion over time is as simple as the solution to a binary star system containing a black hole... eventually through the iterative process of the economy any given dollar is likely to fall into the basket of the rich guy, and it is much harder to escape that basket than the basket of the poor guy who needs to spend simply to live.

The article doesn't seem to conclude that capitalism is flawed though (at least to the extent that Marxism is called for), but that our actual capitalist system needs corrections made before revolutionary corrects get imposed by force.

Re: Capitalism isn't working and here are the reasons why

#3
post #2

Seems important to note that the article doesn't seem to be about capitalism per se , but "business-friendly" capitalism as currently practiced in the U.S. and parts of Europe. In that regard the conclusion (regarding wealth inequality) really isn't that surprising. If the ROI of having money is really higher than the ROI of earning money (i.e. by wages) then the conclusion over time is as simple as the solution to a…

Indeed, it would be wrong to suppose that if capitalism is flawed, that therefore Socialism or Communism, or in fact any other system proposed so far, must be superior. As the article points out capitalism isn't monolithic, as various parts of the world calibrate it differently. I am becoming convinced though that western capitalism dies need some recalibration.

Re: Capitalism isn't working and here are the reasons why

#5
post #2

Seems important to note that the article doesn't seem to be about capitalism per se , but "business-friendly" capitalism as currently practiced in the U.S. and parts of Europe. In that regard the conclusion (regarding wealth inequality) really isn't that surprising. If the ROI of having money is really higher than the ROI of earning money (i.e. by wages) then the conclusion over time is as simple as the solution to a…

My understanding is that is actually "Crony Capitalism", which then if the article redefined it as such, I would agree.

Re: Capitalism isn't working and here are the reasons why

#6
Marx's argument for the inevitability of extreme wealth disparity and at some point a breakdown in the capitalist system is too long to put here, but I can summarize it somewhat. A worker is creating wealth - why else would a company employ him? Let us say he works as a carpenter for a furniture store. He takes $800 worth of wood, nails etc. every day and through his labor makes it into $1000 worth of desks, cabinets etc. What happens with that $1000 in sales? $800 of it goes to buying wood, nails, hammers etc. for the next day. $200 is left over. Some goes to wages to the worker who created the wealth, some goes to profit to the company owners. Let's say it is split down the middle, $100 each way. If the worker works 10 hours a day, he is creating $20 in worth an hour, but only keeping $10 of that. Or you could say he spends the first five hours a day working for himself, and the next five hours he receives none of his own wealth creation, it is expropriated by the capitalists.

What do the capitalists do with their profit? They invest! They buy more capital. They buy capital equipment so that twice as many cabinets and desks can be manufactured in an hour then before. Now, minus the capital cost, with $2000 worth of desks being made a day, with $1600 of daily costs on materials, and keeping the worker at a wage of $100, the capitalist is making $300 a day once his profits pay off the cost of the capital equipment. So the capital spending means a flood of new commodities.

The question becomes - who buys these new commodities? The worker is not going to be buying more desks - he is not making any more than he did before. So then you have "over-production" - too much over-competition, which is not good for capitalists. Marx believed this, but it is not a notion exclusive to Marx - GE CEO Jack Welch has talked about this, as has Peter Thiel, and others. So you get a situation where it is perceived there is a demand for cloud services - so EC2, Linode, Rackspace etc. fund massive capital funding and get into a price war with each other, and people can buy more and more for less and less. There is a ton of capital out there, and demand is not outrageous, so this happens. The bottom line though is the process of profit to capital to more commodities to more profit to more capital to more commodities can't be endless, especially with the consumers wages stagnating. You can get him to get into credit card debt and home mortgage debt and then pass laws saying he can't get out of certain debt and so forth, but this only kicks the can down the road, and makes the inevitable crash worse.

This in a nutshell is one of Marx's major arguments. It is in a nutshell - he wrote more than three large books on this which are difficult to summarize. Replying to thread to argue with one of Marx's ideas is fine, replying to this post because you found some hole in my incredibly condensed argument would be silly - I'm leaving out dozens of caveats which leaves massive holes in my condensed explanation. I have to leave out those caveats or else I'd have to write tens of thousands of more words.

These are interesting articles, especially the 2008 Marxist interpretation of the financial crisis -

http://monthlyreview.org/2013/03/01/class-war-and-labors-dec...

http://monthlyreview.org/2008/12/01/financial-implosion-and-...

Even if you disagree with the analysis, the data they point to is, I think, interesting. Liberals and moderates talk about wealth inequality, debt, how finance is dominating the real economy etc. They don't talk about the slowdown in real GDP growth, the decline of industrial capacity utilization etc.

Re: Capitalism isn't working and here are the reasons why

#7
The problem is that corporate capitalism is a system that delivers the best of both systems (capitalism and socialism) to a well-connected elite and the worst of both to everyone else. For a microcosm, look at commercial air travel. The experience (especially in the lower classes) is Soviet, but the fare-setting (read: price gouging) is hideously capitalistic.

Capitalism generates a set of wealthy people, who pull up the ladder by restricting society to the sorts of capitalism that enhance their wealth, while destroying any variety of business activity that challenges it. That's what we see in the VC-funded world. The VCs have enough capital to kill any fledgling business by funding (or creating, this being the purpose of EIRs) a competitor, but their note-sharing and co-funding makes of them a reputation economy that has more in common with the Politburo than a free-market system.

The problem isn't that capitalism is a bad system. It's that, when you don't have checks and balances that prevent financial and political power being traded for one another, you end up with a corporatist-statist structure rather than a free market. As power concentrates, it only gets worse.

Re: Capitalism isn't working and here are the reasons why

#8

Marx's argument for the inevitability of extreme wealth disparity and at some point a breakdown in the capitalist system is too long to put here, but I can summarize it somewhat. A worker is creating wealth - why else would a company employ him? Let us say he works as a carpenter for a furniture store. He takes $800 worth of wood, nails etc. every day and through his labor makes it into $1000 worth of desks, cabinets…

It's unclear whether the slowdown in US/EU real GDP growth is (a) dysfunction of capitalism, due to what you described, or (b) a "cooling" effect as global inequality of nations (as it should) mean-reverts. The good news is that global GDP growth is quite high: about 4% per year and accelerating (faster than exponential, for now). Obviously, there are severe sustainability concerns (such as the need to move away from planet-baking carbon fuels) that must be addressed. But, if we can address those environmental constraints, the global picture is actually pretty positive.

Worth investigation, however, is what happened in the U.S. in the 1920s. We got really good at agriculture, quickly (i.e. over the course of a few decades). We did a bad job of distributing the wealth generated by that. Commodity prices plummeted as the 1920s wore on. By 1925, there was an epidemic of rural poverty, but those were boom times for the urban rich, so it wasn't called a "depression". In 1927, the economy grew volatile and by 1928 large companies were starting to sweat. The "official" start of the Great Depression was Oct. 1929, and by 1933, the U.S. economy had imploded and the stock market was down almost 90% from its highs.

In the late 1920s, prevailing conservative thought was that poverty was a sort of "moral medicine", because the suffering washed away sin. (It was the same backward, moralistic thinking as was behind Prohibition.) The Depression proved that it's a cancer that spreads relentlessly. If the farmers get poor, the factory workers selling to farmers get poor, and those who have money become risk-averse and hoard it (causing asset crashes) and over time almost everyone ends up losing.

What happened to agricultural commodities in the 1920s is happening to nearly all human labor now. And that's pretty terrifying.

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