Peelian Principles
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Peelian Principles
1–10 of 48 posts
Re: Peelian Principles
#2That is very interesting. I had no idea.
Re: Peelian Principles
#3In the US, Europe and elsewhere, the S.O.P. is "Might makes right" => "We're going to beat the shit out of you if we feel like it, and there's nothing you can do about it. Oh and we're going to rob (whatever personal property or money is on you) too.* "
* This happens not in a "3rd-world country," but in the U.S. of A.
Re: Peelian Principles
#4Even if they state they intend to protect individual freedoms, there is no guarantee. Reality shows that all systems can be perverted and all rules reinterpreted to mean something else.
Re: Peelian Principles
#5Even if they state they intend to protect individual freedoms, there is no guarantee. Reality shows that all systems can be perverted and all rules reinterpreted to mean something else.
It's a book ideal that doesn't recognize reality: the fallibility and self-interests of individuals.
Re: Peelian Principles
#6Even if they state they intend to protect individual freedoms, there is no guarantee. Reality shows that all systems can be perverted and all rules reinterpreted to mean something else.
It's a book ideal that doesn't recognize reality: the fallibility and self-interests of individuals.
So kindly explain what's wrong, in principle, with defining book ideals and then using these as criteria to evaluate the success of organizations?
The Peelian principles have been largely obscured or ignored in recent decades, and arguably they were always a bit hollow -- but the history of British policing since the 1830s has had significantly less emphasis on raw offensive firepower than other police systems: even today the vast majority of British cops do not ever carry guns, and per a 2006 poll of members of the Police Federation, 82% of officers don't want to routinely carry guns:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19641398
This demonstrates, if nothing else, that even after 170-180 years a high-minded book ideal can have a long term effect on an institution (even though we as a species seem to be extremely bad at keeping institutions on track on any time frame longer than a human working lifespan).
And, if I may editorialize a little, being aware that it is possible to constitute a police force along radically unfamiliar lines should free us from the tyranny of low expectations that leads us to assume that current abuses of police powers are inevitable and unexceptional.
We can do better, and we deserve better.
Re: Peelian Principles
#7In the US, Europe and elsewhere, the S.O.P. is "Might makes right" => "We're going to beat the shit out of you if we feel like it, and there's nothing you can do about it. Oh and we're going to rob (whatever personal property or money is on you) too.* " * This happens not in a "3rd-world country," but in the U.S. of A.
Jello Biafra speaks of his possessions being seized in a police raid in the 80s, and the sheriff's office sold them off before he even went to trial - this was (is?) legal in his county.
Re: Peelian Principles
#8In the US, Europe and elsewhere, the S.O.P. is "Might makes right" => "We're going to beat the shit out of you if we feel like it, and there's nothing you can do about it. Oh and we're going to rob (whatever personal property or money is on you) too.* " * This happens not in a "3rd-world country," but in the U.S. of A.
Some areas of the US are more "3rd-world country" than the people care to acknowledge. Mostly due to the legacy of colonialism.
Economy based on manual labour for resource extraction or farming? Yup.
History of racial conflict from the time of slavery? Yup.
Poor rule of law linked to family and business corruption? Yup.
Excessively violent policing as a result of those factors? Yup.
Re: Peelian Principles
#9One thing people need to remember is that in France, UK, Australia, Canada etc guns are illegal. That makes a big difference since police know that provided they don't invade someone's personal space they aren't at risk of dying. And as such they are able to resolve issues without needing to act with a defensive posture.
It may seem arbitrary but you will never think of a policeman as an ordinary citizen if they aren't willing to engage with you in a normal manner.
Re: Peelian Principles
#10Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's a book ideal that doesn't recognize reality: the fallibility and self-interests of individuals.
So kindly explain what's wrong, in principle, with defining book ideals and then using these as criteria to evaluate the success of organizations? The Peelian principles have been largely obscured or ignored in recent decades, and arguably they were always a bit hollow -- but the history of British policing since the 1830s has had significantly less emphasis on raw offensive firepower than other police systems: even…
UK police officers don't want to carry guns because they really don't need to. The most likely threat they are going to face is from a youth carrying a knife (gangs are an issue in outer London boroughs). And since police officers are wearing protective vests a knife attack isn't going to be hitting major organs.